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Councillors protest over flag
11:42am Friday 4th January 2008
Comments (73)TWO PATRIOTIC Calne councillors staged a mini protest at a council meeting last Wednesday.
Couns John Ireland and David Bland sat small union jack flags on the table in front of them in protest against a council decision not to fly the flag above the town hall.
Councillors rejected Royal British Legion branch chairman Coun Ireland's proposal to fly the union jack everyday in November sparking Coun Ireland to walk out of the meeting.
Councillors said the flag would lose significance if flown daily and the yearly cost of £80 was also an issue.
In December Calne resident Mick Davonport launched a one-man campaign to see the flag flown everyday above the town hall.
He said: "I am in correspondence with the town mayor to try and get the flag raised. I have spoken to enough private citizens in the town to know there is a body of feeling behind this move.
"I want to work in partnership with the town council. This is not a politically motivated petition, it is the right thing to do."
Couns Bland and Ireland have vowed to take miniature union jacks to every council meeting until the decision is overturned.
Coun Ireland said: "Calne Town Council has taken what I consider a dreadful decision not to fly the Union Flag from the Town Hall.
"To display our countries flag at every opportunity is a small gesture but with huge symbolical meaning."
A council decision cannot be overturned for six months unless at least eight council members sign a petition asking the proposal to be heard again.
Your Say YourThe Wiltshire Gazette and Herald
AndrewLye, Pembrokeshire says...
12:21pm Fri 4 Jan 08
Many public buildings fly flags, all the time.
We have 3 outside County Hall in Haverfordwest, including the Union flag (not Jack!) and that does not devalue any of the 3 flags. They also fly proudly over nearby Haverfordwest Castle (The Welsh flag and the Union flag).
However, for a councillor to walk out of a meeting is rather childish.
Flags also add colour to the street scene.
Many countries in Europe fly their flags with pride and I remember Vienna as a sea of flags. It looked good.
Fly the flag with pride - including the flag of St George!
I have a small English flag in my car as I'm as proud to be English, even though I now live in Wales.
Joe, Calne says...
12:22pm Fri 4 Jan 08
Clearly they should be flying the flag and thre is no reason not to and why would it cost £80 to do so.
Get the flag on the pole every day of the year and stop this stupidity.
Joe, Calne says...
12:24pm Fri 4 Jan 08
keith, wilts says...
1:01pm Fri 4 Jan 08
Joe, Calne says...
1:10pm Fri 4 Jan 08
The town councils minutes shed no light on the matter either.
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
2:40pm Fri 4 Jan 08
I think this decision is the governments way of trying to crush any form of British Pride or patriotism in general.
But then again, i also want to know why the **** this flag isnt flown from every public building, be it a town hall, public Library, Train Station, Bus Station or council office.
Full respect to the 2 patriots for flying the flag against the wishes of the council.
British Pride!!!
walter, wilshur says...
4:46pm Fri 4 Jan 08
spooks, calne says...
6:21pm Fri 4 Jan 08
Yali wrote:well said yali .
Good on you guys but you could have made it the St George flag. "Councillors said the flag would lose significance if flown daily and the yearly cost of £80 was also an issue." Course it wouldn`t lose it`s significance you dork, nor is 80 quid an issue. You idiots probably spend more on your daily tea and coffee bill.
fly the flag with the pride it stands for.
www.calnetalk.com
P Dolman, Calne says...
6:28pm Fri 4 Jan 08
This is not a case of cost or being patrionic it is just a case of what is sensible. We do not have a history of flying the flag apart from special occassions and this is how, in my opinion, it should remain.
spooks, calne says...
7:57pm Fri 4 Jan 08
P Dolman wrote:so what your saying is that the gazette got it wrong..well whats new there .
I attended the council meeting when this was debated and the council did not object on the grounds of cost and the figure of £80.00 I do not recall being mentioned. Councillor Ireland did not leave the meeting he just moved from the council seats to the public seating and then spent the rest of the evening in discussion with the 3 representatives of the BNP who were at the meeting. This is not a case of cost or being patrionic it is just a case of what is sensible. We do not have a history of flying the flag apart from special occassions and this is how, in my opinion, it should remain.
but what is the problemn of flying the union flag ??why is taking the flag down sensible.?
wouldnt it cost more for someone to put the flag up every now and then .then what it would be to leave it up every day.
we dont really have a lot of britian left so the flag is a great representation .
i would vote to leave it up and fly it with pride
who dat?, says...
8:37pm Fri 4 Jan 08
P Dolman, Calne says...
9:45pm Fri 4 Jan 08
This is not about flying the flag but more about positioning of parties before the byelection on the 31st January in Lickhill Ward. Why do people in Pembrokeshire or indeed anywhere but Calne feel that they need to get involved in this blogg? In fact how did they get to hear about it, I don't read the Carmarthen News! The answer is that they have been asked by their "party" to do so!
Joe, Calne says...
10:48pm Fri 4 Jan 08
Whats a bye election really got to do with it?
Just to be clear i am from Calne and i just think its a daft stance for the council to take and there is no need for it all public buildings should fly the flag with pride
spooks, calne says...
11:55pm Fri 4 Jan 08
Joe wrote:EXACTLEY
If it is not an issue then why dont the town just fly the flag with pride. Whats a bye election really got to do with it? Just to be clear i am from Calne and i just think its a daft stance for the council to take and there is no need for it all public buildings should fly the flag with pride
www.calnetalk.com
donteventhinkit, corsham former calne says...
1:33am Sat 5 Jan 08
P Dolman wrote:Ok thanks for making it all clear your issue is not with who posts comment or the article or the flag its that someone went and chatted to bnp members.Stop being a miserable old fart and get that flag up on its pole where it belongs if private homes hotels and pubs can manage to fly the flag 365 days a year so can the council its our money you spend so spend it on what we want.
I attended the council meeting when this was debated and the council did not object on the grounds of cost and the figure of £80.00 I do not recall being mentioned. Councillor Ireland did not leave the meeting he just moved from the council seats to the public seating and then spent the rest of the evening in discussion with the 3 representatives of the BNP who were at the meeting. This is not a case of cost or being patrionic it is just a case of what is sensible. We do not have a history of flying the flag apart from special occassions and this is how, in my opinion, it should remain.
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
6:04am Sat 5 Jan 08
P Dolman wrote:I have never been asked by the National Front to post on this commentspace. As you will see if you go through the sites archives, i have been posting on the Gazettes stories regularly for quiete some time now!
What I am saying is that this is not an issue, the town councillors are not unpatriotic! This is not about flying the flag but more about positioning of parties before the byelection on the 31st January in Lickhill Ward. Why do people in Pembrokeshire or indeed anywhere but Calne feel that they need to get involved in this blogg? In fact how did they get to hear about it, I don't read the Carmarthen News! The answer is that they have been asked by their "party" to do so!
But whoever posts on here and what their reasons are shouldnt be of any concern to you Whatsoever. Perhaps the guy from Pembrokeshire is originally from Wiltshire and likes to know whats happening in his hometown. I was once in debate ith a communist from Gt Yarmouth on here and i didnt try telling him that he has no place on this commentspace. Its for anyone no matter where in the country they may be! Just who do you think you are in implying he doesnt belong here?
So your reason behind wanting to take down the Union Jack flag, despite the wishes of the people of Calne wanting THEIR flag to stay up, is what exactly?
Yali, Ex-Melksham says...
8:21am Sat 5 Jan 08
P Dolman, Calne says...
9:53am Sat 5 Jan 08
More to the point is that words sre cheap and actions are far more eloquent, if you really want to be patriotic then you should stop taking foreign holidays, buying cheap imports etc etc!
As a wolly minded liberal I do wonder why SwindonNF would want to get involved in this argument which patently will go no where. Perhaps he has nothing better to do, I could suggest that he visits the newly opened Calne Leisure Centre and start taking some physicall excercise.
Happy New Year
Yali, Ex-Melksham says...
12:38pm Sat 5 Jan 08
donteventhinkit, Corsham formally calne says...
4:40am Sun 6 Jan 08
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
1:19am Mon 7 Jan 08
P Dolman wrote:The position you come from? WTF, you dont want your nations flag, be it a Union Jack or a St Georges cross flying over the town hall!!! This is the position of a very unpatriotic person, even by the Liberal Dimocrats standards.
The position I come from is that I am English 1st & British 2nd so if any flag should be flown it would be the cross of St George. More to the point is that words sre cheap and actions are far more eloquent, if you really want to be patriotic then you should stop taking foreign holidays, buying cheap imports etc etc! As a wolly minded liberal I do wonder why SwindonNF would want to get involved in this argument which patently will go no where. Perhaps he has nothing better to do, I could suggest that he visits the newly opened Calne Leisure Centre and start taking some physicall excercise. Happy New Year
Now i holiday in the UK and try not to buy Chinese imports (Where possible) as i see this as keeping my country's folk in employment.
Why would i want to get involved in this argument? The same reason as everyone else! Because if something is happening within my district that i dont like, i publicly speak my mind on the matter. It may get me nowhere, but people can read my point of view and decide if they agree or disagree.
Now please could the council do as the people of Calne ask and get our Union Jack flag on the town hall and preferably as a permanent feature!
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
1:24am Mon 7 Jan 08
donteventhinkit wrote:If actions are better than words, i give my word that i will personally pay the £40 to keep that flag flying above the town hall of Calne for the next 6 months. I have just proposed to half the councils bill from my own pocket. So now the council have no excuse to take it down. Please Dolman, get back to me on why you want it taken down!
Right if actions are better than words will someone please get a ladder and a flag and go hoist the darn thing to shut this bleeding heart liberal up.But then how anyone who snipes about who comments is a liberal god alone knows.Best thing the good folk of Calne can do is vote these wasters off and stick some decent folk in
Joe, Calne says...
10:51am Mon 7 Jan 08
I think the gazzette should run a fly the flag campaign!!
I find it hard to believe the majority of towns folk would have any issue with flying the flag and probably without having looked assumed it was flown anyway.
It baffles me that our elected representatives should have come to such a strange decision and believe they represent the town.
Take the £80 from the Mayors allowance then the money issue is solved.
John Ireland, Calne Wiltshire says...
5:35pm Mon 7 Jan 08
It may have been missed by you all that the families of those honoured dead are frequently put up at the Lansdowne Strand Hotel next door to Calne Town Hall. As for Mr. Dolmans accusations, I did sit next to the BNP after I left the meeting but they were the only people in the hall other than him, it was not for conversation as I did not talk to them. I did however talk to Mr. Dolman but then I talk to anyone. My motion was the last on the open agenda and I left the hall rather than stay for the confidential discussions.
I fear that politics is evident here but this started life as a simple request to fly a Union Flag from the Town Hall and the politics seems to have usurped that for whatever reason. I still want that to happen and I do not consider this issue suitable to be used as a political footbal.
Shame on those however who do.
P Dolman, Calne says...
7:47pm Mon 7 Jan 08
John as far as my comments relating to you I just wanted to set the record straight and let everyone know what really happened. As I told you I am not involved in the forthcoming bye-election and will not be.
me, calne says...
8:00pm Mon 7 Jan 08
Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on Wednesday to get out of Australia, as the government targeted radicals in a bid to head off potential terror attacks.
A day after a group of mainstream Muslim leaders pledged loyalty to Australia and her Queen at a special meeting with Prime Minister John Howard, he and his Ministers made it clear that extremists would face a crackdown. Treasurer Peter Costello, seen as heir apparent to Howard, hinted that some radical clerics could be asked to leave the country if they did not accept that Australia was a secular state, and its laws were made by parliament. "If those are not your values, if you want a country which has Sharia law or a theocratic state, then Australia is not for you", he said on National Television.
"I'd be saying to clerics who are teaching that there are two laws governing people in Australia: one the Australian law and another Islamic law that is false. If you can't agree with parliamentary law, independent courts, democracy, and would prefer Sharia law and have the opportunity to go to another country, which practices it, perhaps, then, that's a better option", Costello said.
Asked whether he meant radical clerics would be forced to leave, he said those with dual citizenship could possibly be asked to move to the other country. Education Minister Brendan Nelson later told reporters that Muslims who did not want to accept local values should "clear off. Basically people who don't want to be Australians, and who don't want, to live by Australian values and understand them, well then, they can basically clear off", he said.
Separately, Howard angered some Australian Muslims on Wednesday by saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation's mosques.
Quote: "IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It. I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians."
"However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the 'politically correct' crowd began complaining about the possibility that our patriotism was offending others. I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to Australia." "However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand." "This idea of Australiabeing a multicultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. And as Australians, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle."
"This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom"
"We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society. Learn the language!"
"Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push, but a fact, because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, because God is part of our culture."
"We will accept your beliefs, and will not question why. All we ask is that you accept ours, and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us."
"If the Southern Cross offends you, or you don't like "A Fair Go", then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet. We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don't care how you did things where you came from. By all means, keep your culture, but do not force it on others.
"This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this. But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom,
'THE RIGHT TO LEAVE'."
"If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to come here. You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted."
Maybe if we circulate this amongst ourselves, citizens will find the backbone to start speaking and voicing the same truths!
GET SOME OF THIS ON THE GO IN THE UK!
Yali, Turkey says...
8:11pm Mon 7 Jan 08
spooks, calne says...
9:03pm Mon 7 Jan 08
no its not sutible for political football.I never realised that the famileys of those who have died for this country stay in the lansdowne.
The town hall should fly the flag and fly it with pride.
any form of patriotism should be encouraged with so much taken away from us.
SO FLY THE FLAG FOR THE PEOPLE OF CALNE,FLY THE FLAG FOR THOSE WHO HAVE DIED IN THE ARMED FORSES.
we put this topic on www.calnetalk.com and the members on there want the flag to fly.they are all people of calne so listen to what the calne people want and put the flag up.
me, calne says...
9:35pm Mon 7 Jan 08
its forces
spooks, calne says...
10:27pm Mon 7 Jan 08
you know what i mean.
as for the posting regarding australia i would love that to happen here unfortunatley we seem to have a goverment what hasnt got the balls to put the wheels in motion.
www.calnetalk.com
me, calne says...
10:30pm Mon 7 Jan 08
DAVE, CALNE says...
11:22pm Mon 7 Jan 08
Sadly, only 2 other Councillors supported us however, 13 voted against. I strongly believe these 13 Councillors should be named and shamed for their actions.
As a Trader in Wootton Bassett I attend all the Repatriation Ceremonies along with other Traders,the people of Bassett, Royal British Legion Members and many Veterans. The people of Bassett are proud to pay tribute to our fallen Service Men and Women. The Wootton Bassett Council fly the Union Jack 365 days a year. Why should we do less? Perhaps the 13 Councillors who are against flying the flag should attend any further Repatriations and see the true cost.
I am suprised and deeply saddened at those Councillors who fail to support us. I can only hope that Public opinion prevails.
DAVE, Calne says...
11:38pm Mon 7 Jan 08
Joe, Calne says...
12:06am Tue 8 Jan 08
It is staggering that our council only has 4 councilors who would support flying the flag and 13 against!!! What possibly could be behind such a large scale objection to flying the flag amoungst councillors would be nice to know
spooks, calne says...
12:25am Tue 8 Jan 08
Joe wrote:quite agree because some of the reasons behind p dolmans reasons for not flying the flag is a load of cods wallop.
Dave Bland is right expression of public opinion to the town council is the best way. It is staggering that our council only has 4 councilors who would support flying the flag and 13 against!!! What possibly could be behind such a large scale objection to flying the flag amoungst councillors would be nice to know
if you asked the residents of calne i am sure that at least 90 per cent would want the flag up.
www.calnetalk.com
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
1:33am Tue 8 Jan 08
John Ireland wrote:Mr Ireland, my backing your request isnt me playing "Political Football". Its me answering as a person on the matter.
I have to tell you all that my motion to fly the Union Flag was not motivated by politics at all but simply by patriotism spurred on by the tragic site of the repatriation of service dead through Wooten Bassett. It may have been missed by you all that the families of those honoured dead are frequently put up at the Lansdowne Strand Hotel next door to Calne Town Hall. As for Mr. Dolmans accusations, I did sit next to the BNP after I left the meeting but they were the only people in the hall other than him, it was not for conversation as I did not talk to them. I did however talk to Mr. Dolman but then I talk to anyone. My motion was the last on the open agenda and I left the hall rather than stay for the confidential discussions. I fear that politics is evident here but this started life as a simple request to fly a Union Flag from the Town Hall and the politics seems to have usurped that for whatever reason. I still want that to happen and I do not consider this issue suitable to be used as a political footbal. Shame on those however who do.
I admire your patriotism and give you full respect. I really hope that you and Mr Bland get elected next election, we need more councillors like you two.
Don, Devizes says...
8:39am Tue 8 Jan 08
me wrote:It's "It's".
SO FLY THE FLAG FOR THE PEOPLE OF CALNE,FLY THE FLAG FOR THOSE WHO HAVE DIED IN THE ARMED FORSES. its forces
Joe, Calne says...
10:08am Tue 8 Jan 08
Wiltshireflag Man, Trowbridge says...
11:44am Tue 8 Jan 08
Since 05/06/07 the new Wiltshire County flag has been flown from County Hall in Trowbridge, so could we consider flying this flag as well as the Union flag on different occasions to try to diffuse the tensions that seem to have arisen over this matter.
Yali, Ex-Melksham says...
1:45pm Tue 8 Jan 08
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
2:06pm Tue 8 Jan 08
Yali wrote:As should the Union Jack
Who gives a toss about whose flag should be flying and whose should not. The St George flag should fly over every council building, police station, Buck palace etc etc without any argument.
Ellie Bland, Calne says...
9:25pm Tue 8 Jan 08
Ellie Bland - Social Secretary. Calne Branch Royal British Legion.
PS As a Member of the last Town Council I witnessed much financial waste, which I voted against. But for 13 of the current Councillors to waste the name of our Town is totally unforgiveable.
me, calne says...
10:40pm Tue 8 Jan 08
Joe, Calne says...
10:43pm Tue 8 Jan 08
me, calne says...
11:06pm Tue 8 Jan 08
donteventhinkit, Calne says...
11:26pm Tue 8 Jan 08
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
1:31am Wed 9 Jan 08
me wrote:And then when you find out who these councillors are, i ask the people of Calne to vote these people out and replace them with people who would better represent the good people of Calne.
it does not take much working out who the thirteen are really, take the two names of the list, go to the town councils website & theres the list , & then you can ask them personally
Why keep voting for people who wont do for Calne, what the people want and ask of them? Please dont continue to kiss the boots that are kicking you!
Yali, Ex-Melksham says...
8:40am Wed 9 Jan 08
Don, Devizes says...
10:08am Wed 9 Jan 08
SwindonNF wrote:And who might those people be who would better represent teh good people of Calne, Joe? You think that hard-working, sitting Councillors should be voted out over one thing - something that seems a little muddied at best? Are we sure that the G&H haev got all the 'facts' right? There seem to be contradctory stories coming out from people who are close to events.
me wrote: it does not take much working out who the thirteen are really, take the two names of the list, go to the town councils website & theres the list , & then you can ask them personallyAnd then when you find out who these councillors are, i ask the people of Calne to vote these people out and replace them with people who would better represent the good people of Calne. Why keep voting for people who wont do for Calne, what the people want and ask of them? Please dont continue to kiss the boots that are kicking you!
And, for the record, I am a bloke with a no. 1 haircut (what there is to cut ... so maybe its not much of a choice) who proudly wears the cross of St George on his shirt - even (maybe especially?) in France. But I'm also a bit of a namby-pamby liberal.
It seems that everyone here is claiming to be patriotic. It's just that we have different ways of showing it.
P Dolman, Calne says...
10:53am Wed 9 Jan 08
spooks, calne says...
11:28am Wed 9 Jan 08
P Dolman wrote:shouldnt the councilours be voting for whats best for calne.?
Surely this is a matter of personal opinion and the councillors who voted for or against this resolution have as much right to decide how they vote as individuals who stae their opinion on this web site. What concerns me is the overtly agressive stance that some contributors are taking. This country has for most of its history allowed the majority to decide what actions to take, why should we now change?
the people of calne voted you all to do whats right for calne .even if you disagree with something and its the best move for calne it should be voted for.we didnt vote you in for your own little playground.so far there has been no good reason why that flag should not stay up but plenty of reason for.
as for voting on a whole many people cant even be bothered to vote or cant be bothered with what the party stands for .
lesson lerned i think.
as for flags on the houses my next door nighbour has the flag of st george on her house which she has done for the past two years.
www.calnetalk.com
Mick devonport, Calne says...
7:48pm Wed 9 Jan 08
RAF Lynham is only a few miles from the centre of our town and it is here that the bodies of brave service men and women who have given their lives in the service of their country are repatriated into the loving arms of their families.
Whereas I have no doubt that Councillors hold feelings of great loyalty to our country and respect for our armed services I would have preferred that instead of suggesting that flying the flag should be reserved for special occasions and VIP visits those members of the Council who appear to have voted against John Irelands proposition should perhaps reflect on the thought that in the minds of many of the folk of Calne these brave young people and the sombre occasions that their homecomings represent are about as important as it gets.
For a counsellor to say that the flag would lose significance if flown all the time, is one that frankly I find astonishing. The Town Hall should be seen as the heart of Calne and as such should declare our loyalty and commitment of our people and to our country by engaging this simple gesture.
In this respect, I feel that without loosing our own identity we should take a lead from other countries where flying of their National Flag can be seen in and on government buildings, schools, colleges and on numerous companies and institutions - including Town Halls.
To follow the Councillor's view is to agree to deprive the people of Calne of the opportunity to make a statement of support and loyalty which frankly I find misguided.
spooks, calne says...
10:44pm Wed 9 Jan 08
www.calnetalk.com
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
1:34am Thu 10 Jan 08
P Dolman wrote:the councillors who voted for or against this resolution have as much right to decide how they vote as individuals who stae their opinion on this web site
Surely this is a matter of personal opinion and the councillors who voted for or against this resolution have as much right to decide how they vote as individuals who stae their opinion on this web site. What concerns me is the overtly agressive stance that some contributors are taking. This country has for most of its history allowed the majority to decide what actions to take, why should we now change?
Are you forgetting that the councillors who voted are supposed to be representing the people who posted on this site? They did after all, ELECT them. Now the councillors are giving the people of Calne a big middle finger salute by taking this stance. I call upon the people of Calne not to vote for these councillors again.
What concerns me is the overtly agressive stance that some contributors are taking
Thats because they want their flag back on that town hall. Whatever the councillors think about it should be irrelivent. The people of Calne want that Union Jack flying from the town hall, so why dont you give them it? Its not a HUGE request is it?
This country has for most of its history allowed the majority to decide what actions to take, why should we now change?
Agreed Mr Dolman!
Why should we now change?
If put to a vote, i am 100% convinced that the people of Calne would vote in favour of having that Union Jack flying from the Town Hall, so why are these 8 councillors over-ruling the majority? Why are you in favour of changing things?
Are you even able to provide a single good reason as to why that flag should not be flown?
Wiltshireflag Man, Trowbridge says...
4:34pm Thu 10 Jan 08
P Dolman, Calne says...
11:04am Fri 11 Jan 08
While I respect messrs Davenport, Ireland & Blands opinions I think it is not the pressing subject its made out to be.
Joe, Calne says...
11:13am Fri 11 Jan 08
It should be assumed that the flag is flown over public buildings that should be the norm not the exception.
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
9:44pm Fri 11 Jan 08
P Dolman wrote:Yet you are still unable to provide a single decent reason as to why it shouldnt be flown over Calne town hall, other than "Cos The Councillors said so".
Dear SwindonNF I agree that there are a number of Calne residents who are for patriotic (and unfortunately other reasons)in favour of flying the flag I feel it is not a hot topic in the town dispite what others may say. I have no doubt that a vote on this subject will get a no vote, partly as the majority have no opinion at all. This is partly evidenced by the relatively small number of Calne residents taking part in this debate (I discount non residents as you would not get a vote). While I respect messrs Davenport, Ireland & Blands opinions I think it is not the pressing subject its made out to be.
Harris, Calne says...
10:03pm Mon 14 Jan 08
P Dolman wrote:Mr Dolman,
Dear SwindonNF I agree that there are a number of Calne residents who are for patriotic (and unfortunately other reasons)in favour of flying the flag I feel it is not a hot topic in the town dispite what others may say. I have no doubt that a vote on this subject will get a no vote, partly as the majority have no opinion at all. This is partly evidenced by the relatively small number of Calne residents taking part in this debate (I discount non residents as you would not get a vote). While I respect messrs Davenport, Ireland & Blands opinions I think it is not the pressing subject its made out to be.
I live in Calne and I want to see the Union Flag flown from the Town Council flag pole. I want this for two reasons:
1. I am patriotic
2. I see it as a show of support for our brave troops fighting overseas
You are completely wrong to feel that this is not a hot topic in the town; the turnout from the town at St Marys on Remembrance Sunday is a clear indication of that.
You are completely wrong to have no doubt that a vote on this subject would get a no vote and you completely misjudge the people you are supposed to represent by saying that the majority have no opinion at all. You site the relatively small number of residents taking part in this debate as evidence to support your view. I find it extremely concerning that you a Councillor would consider this as evidence and base your judgements on it. There are many reasons why the people of Calne are not taking part in this debate, I havent taken part until now as I didnt even know of its existence until yesterday.
Lastly, if you really dont think this is the pressing subject it is made out to be then you are completely out of touch with the people you are supposed to be representing.
If you do chose to respond to this email then please explain why you have chosen to support this wholly unpatriotic decision against the wishes of many of the people of Calne.
Harris, Calne says...
10:43pm Mon 14 Jan 08
Having thought a bit more about your evidence you possibly could use it by considering the views in this thread as representative of the views of a cross-section of Calne's residents. In which case the people who support flying the flag would outnumber those who don't by at least 10:1.
P Dolman, Calne says...
6:53am Sat 19 Jan 08
The town council voted to recommend that the elections are deferred until May 2013 which means the current councillors will be in place for 6 years. So unless they change their minds the debate is over. Councillor Ireland I understand voter to stay in office for 6 years. So much for the voters right to register their dissatisfaction.
Joe, Calne says...
12:43pm Sat 19 Jan 08
Harris, Calne says...
9:06pm Sat 19 Jan 08
FLAG FLYING CONSULTATION
The Committee received a consultation from the Department for Culture, Media and Sport relating to the flying of the Union flag on Government buildings. Members noted that at present the Union flag should be flown on 18 fixed days many relating to the Royal Family. It was agreed that in the interests of fairness and to celebrate pride in nationality the Union Flag should be flown at all times. Members requested that consideration be given to the erection of another flag pole (possibly illuminated) at The White House as they wished to continue flying the Town Council flag on the existing pole.
RECOMMENDED : that Council agree to the flying of the Union Flag at all times from The White House and that an illuminated flag pole be erected to effect this development.
Well done Leighton-Linslade Town Council who have made an entirely reasoned and patriotic judgement in complete contrast to Calne Town Council who continue to refuse to give any valid explanation as to why they have taken their current and unpatriotic position over the flying of the Union Flag.
The Union flag should fly throughout the year from all civil buildingstown halls, council buildings, all Government Department buildings and from every school. The Union Flag is a symbol of unity that cuts across divisions such as religion, ethnic background and class the Union Flag represents all British people.
The Union Flag is a flag that the vast majority of British people are proud of, a flag under which many many people have proudly fought and too many have given their lives.
The fact that the Union flag now flies from a growing number of Government Department buildings is encouraging and entirely the right thing to do. Calne Town Council should follow this growing movement and have an obligation to do so as a rapidly increasing number of people in Calne desire it.
There is nothing wrong with the Union flag; we should be extremely proud of it. The people of Calne want to show their loyalty and patriotism and their support of our brave service personnel by flying the Union Flag from the Town Hall. Calne Town Councils vote against this move is flagrantly disloyal, unpatriotic and shows a complete lack of respect for our Armed Forces and the wishes of the people of Calne. Their decision is quite bluntly baffling.
P Dolman, Calne says...
10:25am Mon 21 Jan 08
Hannah, Calne says...
1:15pm Wed 23 Jan 08
Harris, Calne says...
9:42pm Thu 24 Jan 08
From the Telegraph, (6th Jul 2007)
Gordon Brown flies Union flag all year long
The Union flag was flying across Whitehall yesterday in a display of national solidarity against terrorism.
Gordon Brown has ordered that all Government buildings should fly the flag as a patriotic gesture to help create a new sense of Britishness.
No 10 Downing Street, the Treasury, Revenue and Customs, and the Departments of Culture and Health were among those that had hoisted the flag by yesterday.
In his first Commons statement as Prime Minister on Tuesday, Mr Brown said he intended to lift the restriction which prohibited the flying of the Union flag from Government buildings for more than 18 fixed days a year.
However, an official "direction" has now gone out that all Government buildings that have flag poles should fly the flag 365 days a year.
A spokesman for the Culture Department said that Mr Brown would like other public buildings, such as police stations, prisons and hospitals, to follow suit.
According to a blueprint for constitutional reform published by the Justice Department, symbols such as flags could help to embody a national culture and citizenship. "The Union flag is one of the most recognisable symbols of the UK.
From the Wiltshire Times, (6th Jul 2007)
Union flag flies at council HQ
The Union flag is flying over West Wiltshire District Council's offices in Trowbridge after the Prime Minister abolished a decades-old rule.
The rule stated the flag could only be flown on certain days of the year but Gordon Brown said it would be up to individual public offices to decide if and when the flag is flown.
The flag will be a permanent fixture after being raised at the district council's offices in Bradley Road at 9am this morning, but it will be taken down every night so it doesn't get stolen.
Skip back up through the comments posted above to find other towns where the flag is flown with pride.
Harris, Calne says...
10:45pm Thu 24 Jan 08
SPECIMEN LETTER TO CALNE TOWN COUNCIL
********************
**
Dear Sir,
Re: Flying our Flag
As I am sure you are aware, the Prime Minister has officially directed that all Government buildings that have flag poles should fly the flag 365 days a year.
As a local resident I am disappointed to note that Calne Town Council does not fly the Union flag. Is there any reason for this and would the Council be prepared to reconsider its policy?
Many thanks in anticipation of an early response.
Yours Faithfully,
********************
**
Samantha, Calne says...
11:48pm Thu 24 Jan 08
Hannah wrote:I agree!
If £80 is that much of an issue, can you not ask everyone in Calne to give some money towards it. I mean, come on, £1 off of everyone who wants to fly it?? That'd make make more than enough!! It's not as though we have to pay hundreds of punds for it. And I'm sure anyone who wants the flag would be willing to donate a bit of money. It's not hard.
In fact, I was saying this only yesterday to a friend! If they really need the money, just ask the people of Calne! I'm sure many people would be willing to do this!
Emdub, Calne & Proud says...
3:28pm Fri 25 Jan 08
There are thousands of people in Calne who are homeowners and pay a small fortune in council tax.
£80 is small change to the council so this clearly isn't the issue.
I would be happy if just for once, the selected representatives of this town would actually listen to what the people of Calne are saying - AND JUST DO IT.
Joe, Calne says...
10:30pm Fri 25 Jan 08
Whats truely amazing is that there were ever rules restricting the flying.
The council has made a fool of itself and probably cant find a way out which still does not make it look daft.
Harris, Calne says...
5:03pm Sat 2 Feb 08
The details are:
Meeting of the Town Council to be held in the LARGE HALL of the Town Hall, Calne on MONDAY 4 FEBRUARY 2008 at 6.30 pm, as there will be a presentation prior to the commencement of the meeting at 6.45 pm.
Doors will open at 6.15pm and Questions and Statements will be taken from members of the public for 15 minutes from 6.45pm, prior to the start of the meeting, in accordance with the Town Councils Standing Order No 8.
Please pass this message on to as many other people in Calne as you can in order to get as large an attendance as possible to show support for the Fly the Flag campaign.
SwindonNF, Swindon says...
8:51pm Fri 8 Feb 08
Hannah wrote:I pledged to donate £40 earlier in the thread
If £80 is that much of an issue, can you not ask everyone in Calne to give some money towards it. I mean, come on, £1 off of everyone who wants to fly it?? That'd make make more than enough!! It's not as though we have to pay hundreds of punds for it. And I'm sure anyone who wants the flag would be willing to donate a bit of money. It's not hard.
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Yali, Ex-Melksham says...
12:19pm Fri 4 Jan 08
"Councillors said the flag would lose significance if flown daily and the yearly cost of £80 was also an issue."
Course it wouldn`t lose it`s significance you dork, nor is 80 quid an issue. You idiots probably spend more on your daily tea and coffee bill.