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Leisure centre plan thrown out
11:59am Thursday 19th April 2007
Comments (67)The latest plan to save the White Horse Leisure Centre in Calne has been rejected by North Wiltshire District Council.
Athena Leisure submitted the proposal to district council chief executive Delwyn Burbidge on Monday but it does not meet the strict criteria set down by the authority for the running of the centre.
Supporters of the rescue plan were worried that vandals would damage the centre beyond repair before it could be saved but its future is now set.
Since it closed on March 31, vandals have tried to pull down the boards covering the lower windows and smashed windows on the upper floors.
John Bentley School is taking over the dry side facilities at the centre for use by its pupils but the pool will not be saved.
The Athena plan gave some hope to Calne residents desperate to see the pool kept open but the district council has always been open about the failings of Athena's plans.
The most recent plan was given to officers to consider but once again it failed to outline how it could protect the council from exposure to further financial risk.
A spokesman for the council said: "The decision to reject the plan was made by officers who set the criteria for recovery plans.
"Plans put forward must not expose the council to any further financial risks. The council has agreed to provide a one-off payment of £60,000 which was going to be used to secure the building when it closed.
"This money had to be guaranteed if needed by any group, so that in the event of a recovery plan being unsuccessful, Athena would have to pay back the money to the council to enable it to secure the building at that stage.
"Officers have considered the plans submitted by Athena Leisure and the proposals fail on a number of areas.
"The council has already discussed these problems with Athena Leisure and the Calne Community Area Partnership at a joint meeting with the town council, John Bentley School and Wiltshire County Council, last month."
A letter from the council was sent to Athena Leisure on Monday, informing it that the plan does not meet the agreed criteria.
The spokesman said: "We will be writing to them in detail again this week setting out exactly where the plan fails and why."
Your Say YourThe Wiltshire Gazette and Herald
Helen, Calne says...
2:34pm Thu 19 Apr 07
What a joke! I feel sorry for the children of Calne, where will they meet up ans socialise now? the town centre no doubt. I think it's really unfair that Calne has been denied the chance of keeping the WHLC open. Nothing ever changes for the better.
Nicki Marshallsay, Calne says...
2:51pm Thu 19 Apr 07
What now for the youth of this town? our only real hope for them is if we can develope the Beversbrook site and eventually include an indoor centre there.
I'm all in favour of the pitches and the developement that is going on there and think that now we have definately lost the WHLC that we should all now back the plans for that site. Maybe we will see a 50m pool there one day!!!
I'm all in favour of the pitches and the developement that is going on there and think that now we have definately lost the WHLC that we should all now back the plans for that site. Maybe we will see a 50m pool there one day!!!
angie easton, a very sad calne says...
3:12pm Thu 19 Apr 07
I didn't expect anything else from this shower of a council! they're incompetance sees 'our' centre close, and we pay the price!
Is this the end for Athena? or is there anything we can do to fight the councils decision?
Our children have nowhere to go thats safe, this, in 2007 when were hosting the olympic games!
Is this the end for Athena? or is there anything we can do to fight the councils decision?
Our children have nowhere to go thats safe, this, in 2007 when were hosting the olympic games!
piddle, calne says...
3:56pm Thu 19 Apr 07
'I don't believe it'. Please remember this when the voting starts soon. I have nothing against Athena Leisure but with respect I don't want them running the centre (with their shareholders and no experience...an NHS mgr and squash coach do not constitute a business plan....and in case anyone wants to know...yes I have managed leisure centres in thge Middle East and it needs a lot of money). I want a responsible council with a commitment to the local community...just like the library the centre should be seen as an amenity. If they can not do it with the shower we currently have then hopefully Wilts CC will do better.
I'm not giving up on Calne but it's getting difficult. Just had a look on google earth and the development of Tyning Park would run very nicely into the centres land!!Or am I just negative. Please put your name down on my petition. Only 414 so far. Does that say anything about it's useage? http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/CalneSports/
I'm not giving up on Calne but it's getting difficult. Just had a look on google earth and the development of Tyning Park would run very nicely into the centres land!!Or am I just negative. Please put your name down on my petition. Only 414 so far. Does that say anything about it's useage? http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/CalneSports/
Mark Ward, Calne says...
4:38pm Thu 19 Apr 07
As I watch this sorry state if affiers malinger on - and I for one am all for the health, fitness and education using the lifelong learning continuim - I can't help feel that the point has been seriously missed. That being that there was a strstegic leisure feasibilyt study and needs analysis complted for the District and frankly Calne is over provided for in leisure facilities. National Averages form the ONS will tell you that between 5 and 7% of nay populace actually use a local leisure centre. They have to be subsidised in some way to keep costs realistic for the majority of the demographic who then don't bother to use them - especially in rural locations. St Marys is subsideised by schools fees and benefactors. It's pricing is very competitive and realistic and is a modern facility with far lower running costs than aged buidling like White Horse. The ONLY reason that Lime KIln has been "saved" is a political one and it will close within 18 months. NWDC have had an agenda going back 5 years which has involved closing Cricklade, Lime Kiln and White Horse. They have never been interetsed in these facilities and refused to maintian them or provide enough funding as the landlord of the buildings to sustain them long term.
The reality is that we are where we are - the building is not fit for the purpose in the modern age, can;t compete with other facilities and id under used by the very populcae it is there to serve. As for John Bentley - they paid circa £0.50 per capita per annum for thier use of the facility. Hardly refelective of actual the costs.
There are very few public facilityies in the UK that are not subsidisied by thioer parent authority. The reason behind the move to competitive tendering and trusts by the govenrment and industry was designed to remove this subsidy - it was designed to make lesiure (and many other) services more effecient. Rather than doing this NWDC have raped this service, cut it to the bone and now it is of no use to anyone. How can you coninually cut funding with rising costs of inflation, energy and living add to that under investment in property management and maintenance - these then lead to falling numbers and a downward spiral to destruction. NWDC knew this. The NWLL Board should also be ashamed of themselves for allowing this to happen - thier charte states quite clearly that thier reason for being is for the good of the communities it serves. Their Chairman has been remarkably quiet on the subject. I am sure there must be some corportae culbablity for a Board of Directors who allowed this to happen. There will no doebt be political culpability at the ballot box. However in attepting to save White Horse - dont forget the study, the facts and I suppoose some of the fiction - the facility is no longer required in a stragic sense and the usage is not there to sustain it. We are all emotional at this great loss and why it became so but there has to be some realism and acknowledgemnt of its need now.
The reality is that we are where we are - the building is not fit for the purpose in the modern age, can;t compete with other facilities and id under used by the very populcae it is there to serve. As for John Bentley - they paid circa £0.50 per capita per annum for thier use of the facility. Hardly refelective of actual the costs.
There are very few public facilityies in the UK that are not subsidisied by thioer parent authority. The reason behind the move to competitive tendering and trusts by the govenrment and industry was designed to remove this subsidy - it was designed to make lesiure (and many other) services more effecient. Rather than doing this NWDC have raped this service, cut it to the bone and now it is of no use to anyone. How can you coninually cut funding with rising costs of inflation, energy and living add to that under investment in property management and maintenance - these then lead to falling numbers and a downward spiral to destruction. NWDC knew this. The NWLL Board should also be ashamed of themselves for allowing this to happen - thier charte states quite clearly that thier reason for being is for the good of the communities it serves. Their Chairman has been remarkably quiet on the subject. I am sure there must be some corportae culbablity for a Board of Directors who allowed this to happen. There will no doebt be political culpability at the ballot box. However in attepting to save White Horse - dont forget the study, the facts and I suppoose some of the fiction - the facility is no longer required in a stragic sense and the usage is not there to sustain it. We are all emotional at this great loss and why it became so but there has to be some realism and acknowledgemnt of its need now.
Elaine King, Calne says...
4:39pm Thu 19 Apr 07
No, I don't think you are being negative at all. There may not be many names on the list but you have to remember that not everyone is on the internet. What's more I know of several people who live in Chippenham but choose to bring their children to Calne because the pool is so much better but may be unaware of the conflict going on here. I am feeling very sad today.
Anon, it can be done says...
5:05pm Thu 19 Apr 07
How do I contact Athena or the local action group please?
piddle, calne says...
5:14pm Thu 19 Apr 07
Mark Wards comments are very near the mark. It's maybe time to stand back and look at the bigger picture.
Elaine King, Calne says...
5:16pm Thu 19 Apr 07
How very sad I feel this afternoon on hearing that Athena's plan to save the Calne Leisure Centre has been thrown out by NWDC due, they say, to the fact that the plan did not meet the very strict criteria laid down by the Authority. I wonder, did they indicate what the criteria were prior to Athena preparing their plan? Or did they wait to see what the plan was before playing their trump card?!!.
I see that the Beversbrook project has been more fortunate than the Leisure Centre having been given £1,000,000 by the Football Foundation, £600,000 by Calne Town Council, £75,000 by NWDC and £10,000 by the Quality Parish Investment Fund totalling ONE MILLION,SIX HUNDRED AND EIGHTY FIVE THOUSAND POUNDS!! and very good luck to them. I hope these facilities will be used sufficiently to warrant such generous funding.
However, I find it quite irksome that Calne will now have 2 adult football pitches, 3 youth football pitches 4 mini soccer pitches, a rugby pitch, a cricket pitch plus an 8 room changing and social facility. AND NOT A DROP OF WATER IN SIGHT !!!!!!!!!
How unjust is that?
It just brings home to me what a bunch of short-sighted, inane and inadequate nincompoops are running the North Wilts District Council.
I see that the Beversbrook project has been more fortunate than the Leisure Centre having been given £1,000,000 by the Football Foundation, £600,000 by Calne Town Council, £75,000 by NWDC and £10,000 by the Quality Parish Investment Fund totalling ONE MILLION,SIX HUNDRED AND EIGHTY FIVE THOUSAND POUNDS!! and very good luck to them. I hope these facilities will be used sufficiently to warrant such generous funding.
However, I find it quite irksome that Calne will now have 2 adult football pitches, 3 youth football pitches 4 mini soccer pitches, a rugby pitch, a cricket pitch plus an 8 room changing and social facility. AND NOT A DROP OF WATER IN SIGHT !!!!!!!!!
How unjust is that?
It just brings home to me what a bunch of short-sighted, inane and inadequate nincompoops are running the North Wilts District Council.
Nicki Marshallsay, says...
7:55pm Thu 19 Apr 07
You can contact Athena via Calne Community Area Partnership and your contact is Jill Martin.
Julie Lovelock, Calne says...
11:13pm Thu 19 Apr 07
Well, this seems like this might be the end of the road for the White Horse Leisure Centre.
I'm sorry that NWDC did not have the courage or imagination to encourage and support a bid from Athena Leisure as we might have ended up with a fantastic sports facility in the town - OK it might not have worked out and we would have ended up with nothing, but thats where we are now isn't it?
I'd just like to thank Jill Martin, Mick Devonport and all the others who worked so hard in trying to save the centre. I'm sorry that the staff all lost their jobs and I'm sorry that I won't be doing any more aerobics classes in WHLC which had the best activities room of all the local centres and I'm missing all my friends from the classes and I hope to see you all soon.
I suppose the next battle will be after NWDC have sold the site off for development, to ensure that the proceeds from the sale come back to Calne and are invested in building a new centre - perhaps we ought to call it the Phoenix Centre - rising from the ashes!
I'm sorry that NWDC did not have the courage or imagination to encourage and support a bid from Athena Leisure as we might have ended up with a fantastic sports facility in the town - OK it might not have worked out and we would have ended up with nothing, but thats where we are now isn't it?
I'd just like to thank Jill Martin, Mick Devonport and all the others who worked so hard in trying to save the centre. I'm sorry that the staff all lost their jobs and I'm sorry that I won't be doing any more aerobics classes in WHLC which had the best activities room of all the local centres and I'm missing all my friends from the classes and I hope to see you all soon.
I suppose the next battle will be after NWDC have sold the site off for development, to ensure that the proceeds from the sale come back to Calne and are invested in building a new centre - perhaps we ought to call it the Phoenix Centre - rising from the ashes!
Disappointed resident,, Calne says...
10:34am Fri 20 Apr 07
Have to say that I wasn't surprised to hear of the decision. I think all of us who attended the meetings knew that NWDC had no intention of allowing the White Horse to remain open. Shame for all the youth of this town. I'm sure we can now expect the town to hit the headlines again over youth offending, after all, there is now nothing for the youth of the Calne to do and nowhere for them to meet. After throwing all the money at the Beaversbrook sports project, will the council be throwing even more when they realise that the sports pitches are not being used fully, just like the new facility at Chippenham which I believe our council tax subsidised to the tune of over £30k last year.
martin butler , chairman calne cc, calne says...
11:13am Fri 20 Apr 07
As a cricket club we WILL be using the new ground to its full potential, it will be used 7 days a week during april to september,youth cricket will be held on week nights for under 9`s, u11`s, u13`s & u15`s, for training etc, adults will also use the site for training on weeknights, midweek games & will be used at weekends for youth games & adult fixtures .
At present we have nearly 100 youth members at our club , we anticipate that this will rise when we move to much improved facilitys due to the fact that our qualified ECB coaches are delivering cricket coaching in various schools around the town at present, five days a week for the next 12 weeks.
AS you can probably see this new complex will be used by your local cricket club to its full potential. www.calne-cricket-club.co.uk Have a look, ANYBODY that wants to come along are welcome
At present we have nearly 100 youth members at our club , we anticipate that this will rise when we move to much improved facilitys due to the fact that our qualified ECB coaches are delivering cricket coaching in various schools around the town at present, five days a week for the next 12 weeks.
AS you can probably see this new complex will be used by your local cricket club to its full potential. www.calne-cricket-club.co.uk Have a look, ANYBODY that wants to come along are welcome
Gary, says...
1:41pm Fri 20 Apr 07
There is a very simple and effective way to save this facility - but it requires people to put money where thier conviction is.
If you truly believe that the study into leisure provision in North Wilts is wrong and that threr IS a definite need for the Centre then here is what to do -
Allow Athena, or whatever management structure is in place - personally I think you should consider a community trust which gives special priveledges and VAT dispensations on income - but allow whatever vehicle is used to manage the centre to collect a membership fee up front for the next 12 months of say £400.
This will prove that the market is there (if it is) and give NWDC the financial security they require. 500 members at £400 = £200,000.
If the "people" of Calne truly want to save the Centre then get the money in the bank in advance. Money always talks and is certainly the ONLY langauge that NWDC understands in this case.
Of course I mention this in simplistic terms but NWLL were charging £396 a year for membership. The membership can be structured as family membership with dicounts etc on premium items such as swim lessons. There is bound to be an opprtunity for local business to support such a worthy cause which does effect the economics of the town.
The point is you have to PROVE that the need is there and that it WILL be used.
So come on people - are there 500 of you out there willing to take the gamble - nearly 500 have signed the petition. So set up a community trust and run the centre by the community for the community. It can be done - it is being done all over the UK.
If you truly believe that the study into leisure provision in North Wilts is wrong and that threr IS a definite need for the Centre then here is what to do -
Allow Athena, or whatever management structure is in place - personally I think you should consider a community trust which gives special priveledges and VAT dispensations on income - but allow whatever vehicle is used to manage the centre to collect a membership fee up front for the next 12 months of say £400.
This will prove that the market is there (if it is) and give NWDC the financial security they require. 500 members at £400 = £200,000.
If the "people" of Calne truly want to save the Centre then get the money in the bank in advance. Money always talks and is certainly the ONLY langauge that NWDC understands in this case.
Of course I mention this in simplistic terms but NWLL were charging £396 a year for membership. The membership can be structured as family membership with dicounts etc on premium items such as swim lessons. There is bound to be an opprtunity for local business to support such a worthy cause which does effect the economics of the town.
The point is you have to PROVE that the need is there and that it WILL be used.
So come on people - are there 500 of you out there willing to take the gamble - nearly 500 have signed the petition. So set up a community trust and run the centre by the community for the community. It can be done - it is being done all over the UK.
Elaine King, Calne says...
3:29pm Fri 20 Apr 07
I don't profess to know anything about Community Trusts Gary and I'm not saying that, for me, it would be out of the question to pay £400 up front, but what you have to take into account now is the fact that almost all the people who were members of White Horse Leisure Centre have now joined other sports centres and their money is spoken for.
I was at St Mary's swimming pool this morning and was chatting with a lady I had'nt seen before. She was saying how very sad it is that WHLC has closed. She remarked that the council is very blinkered that they see no need for a sports centre. Her children had apparently used the pool during their childhood and they are sad that their children are being denied. She herself had used the pool at WHLC ever since it was built.
I then went to Sainsbury's and by the fruit and veg there were three young women deep in conversation, and guess what they were talking about? yep, your right, the closure of the leisure centre. I only heard a few snippets of their conversation although I was very tempted to join in! They were complaining that they now have to pick their children up from school and drive to another town so that they can swim, how senseless is that?
It's a contradiction in terms- The Government are encouraging parents to walk their childeren to school, not only to avoid becoming obese but also to cut down on carbon emissions from all the exhaust pipes on cars. But NOW they are not only doing the school run but driving for probably another hour as they ferry the children to other towns and back.
I ask you, where is the logic in that?
I was at St Mary's swimming pool this morning and was chatting with a lady I had'nt seen before. She was saying how very sad it is that WHLC has closed. She remarked that the council is very blinkered that they see no need for a sports centre. Her children had apparently used the pool during their childhood and they are sad that their children are being denied. She herself had used the pool at WHLC ever since it was built.
I then went to Sainsbury's and by the fruit and veg there were three young women deep in conversation, and guess what they were talking about? yep, your right, the closure of the leisure centre. I only heard a few snippets of their conversation although I was very tempted to join in! They were complaining that they now have to pick their children up from school and drive to another town so that they can swim, how senseless is that?
It's a contradiction in terms- The Government are encouraging parents to walk their childeren to school, not only to avoid becoming obese but also to cut down on carbon emissions from all the exhaust pipes on cars. But NOW they are not only doing the school run but driving for probably another hour as they ferry the children to other towns and back.
I ask you, where is the logic in that?
angie, calne says...
3:44pm Fri 20 Apr 07
I think its great that the kids have at long last got their cricket & soccer pitches. Its a shame though we cant have both. I miss my aerobics classes and friends I have made at whlc , also my daughter is really missing the pool and the friday night pool disco! Its crazy all we want to do is exercise!!!!!
angie, calne says...
1:27pm Sat 21 Apr 07
Has anybody heard anything from Athena?
does anybody know if thats it now, or are they re- considering their position? the new headline for calne is 'the town that tops the league of shame'. wiltshire's worst place for bad behaviour! this situation is only going to get worse, if we dont give our youth something/somewhere to go. there is now nothing in calne for the kids.
does anybody know if thats it now, or are they re- considering their position? the new headline for calne is 'the town that tops the league of shame'. wiltshire's worst place for bad behaviour! this situation is only going to get worse, if we dont give our youth something/somewhere to go. there is now nothing in calne for the kids.
John, says...
7:22pm Sun 22 Apr 07
It is without doubt a tragedy that has been allowed to happen to this centre. The blame lies firmly at the feet of NWDC and in particular Delwyn Burbidge and his merry band of idiots.
This centre has been allowed to deteriorate over the last 6 years or so, to the sorry state it is in now. The ex member of staff is correct when he says that NWDC were over seeing the NWLL management. of course they were. NWDC were NWDC were paying them £1,000,0000 pa. Burbidge and his merry band are now hiding behind the fact that NWLL was a private company and they had no control and no access to information. In that case why were they handing out millions of pounds of our money to NWLL who don't appear to be able tell us where the money went!
I would ask Jill Martin and Mick Devonport to push for some sort of investigation into the activities of this shower of incompetent fools.
The district council never had any intention of allowing Athena or any other group to run the centre. This was confirmed when the interim manager a DC leisure bod, announced smugly to the staff that Athena would never be allowed to operate from here. The agreement that DC leisure have with the council almost certainly ensures that the centre can never reopen.
Why doesn't Burbidge and his side kicks come out and be honest for once and tell the truth or has it been so long that this over paid weasel has forgotten what the truth is!!!
This centre has been allowed to deteriorate over the last 6 years or so, to the sorry state it is in now. The ex member of staff is correct when he says that NWDC were over seeing the NWLL management. of course they were. NWDC were NWDC were paying them £1,000,0000 pa. Burbidge and his merry band are now hiding behind the fact that NWLL was a private company and they had no control and no access to information. In that case why were they handing out millions of pounds of our money to NWLL who don't appear to be able tell us where the money went!
I would ask Jill Martin and Mick Devonport to push for some sort of investigation into the activities of this shower of incompetent fools.
The district council never had any intention of allowing Athena or any other group to run the centre. This was confirmed when the interim manager a DC leisure bod, announced smugly to the staff that Athena would never be allowed to operate from here. The agreement that DC leisure have with the council almost certainly ensures that the centre can never reopen.
Why doesn't Burbidge and his side kicks come out and be honest for once and tell the truth or has it been so long that this over paid weasel has forgotten what the truth is!!!
Helen, Calne says...
7:30pm Sun 22 Apr 07
I feel sorry for Jill and Mick who have put in hours of work and I know they have been trying everything they can to keep Athena on board.
I believe that Athena submitted a business plan, where they tried to cover the points raised by the council, but nobody in any right frame of mind is going to allow themselves to be dictated to by this bunch of clowns.
Athena can't win no matter what they do now. I think they should call it a day as far as this centre is concerned and accept that NWDC are in partnership with DC leisure and thats the end of it
I believe that Athena submitted a business plan, where they tried to cover the points raised by the council, but nobody in any right frame of mind is going to allow themselves to be dictated to by this bunch of clowns.
Athena can't win no matter what they do now. I think they should call it a day as far as this centre is concerned and accept that NWDC are in partnership with DC leisure and thats the end of it
Calne supporter, Warminster says...
7:41pm Sun 22 Apr 07
I must say I'm surprised that Athena stayed on board as long as they did, with some of the appalling attacks on them by groups of ill informed readers of this site.
Our club chairman has met Craig Pickles in Warminster, far from being the "nobody" that someone described him as, he is an accountant and extremely accomplished business man, has anyone looked at the size of of TYM tractors. Our committee meets with the rest of the team as we continue to battle our way through the politcal minefield of West Wilts DC. They are not the fools that some people have called them. The District council should be brought to account with the chief executive himself in the front line.
Our club chairman has met Craig Pickles in Warminster, far from being the "nobody" that someone described him as, he is an accountant and extremely accomplished business man, has anyone looked at the size of of TYM tractors. Our committee meets with the rest of the team as we continue to battle our way through the politcal minefield of West Wilts DC. They are not the fools that some people have called them. The District council should be brought to account with the chief executive himself in the front line.
Mick Devonport, Calne says...
7:26am Mon 23 Apr 07
The thoughts above are a real mixed bag and I guess that is only to be expected given the situation we are in.
We have now finally received a document from NWDC outlining where they feel we do not meet their criteria.
We have been working for the past couple of days with the Athena people to produce a new plan which addresses every one of their issues (albeit we still do not agree with some of their requirements) and will be submitting this very soon.
Can I ask everyone to remember that the only people who are putting themselves at any financial risk are Athena Leisure Ltd. The money that CTC have kindly allocated will only be drawn down if the NWDC give their approval. As it currently stands if the Centre is not a success the £60,000 offered by NWDC will have to be paid back. Athena have earmarked their own funds to carry out work on the Centre and for this I would ask as I did once before for the people of the town to show their support for this organisation who have stuck with us through thick and thin.
My last word is for the parents of the kids who feel that they should vandalise the centre as part of their contribution to saving the site. I think it ironic and highly likely that some of the parents involved have and will in the future use the Centre.
When we win this battle (and win we will) Calne will have the best public sports and leisure facilites in the county provided by our Centre and Beversbrook in association with sports development through JBS and Springfields plus other organisations with whom we are talking.
Please stick with us.
We have now finally received a document from NWDC outlining where they feel we do not meet their criteria.
We have been working for the past couple of days with the Athena people to produce a new plan which addresses every one of their issues (albeit we still do not agree with some of their requirements) and will be submitting this very soon.
Can I ask everyone to remember that the only people who are putting themselves at any financial risk are Athena Leisure Ltd. The money that CTC have kindly allocated will only be drawn down if the NWDC give their approval. As it currently stands if the Centre is not a success the £60,000 offered by NWDC will have to be paid back. Athena have earmarked their own funds to carry out work on the Centre and for this I would ask as I did once before for the people of the town to show their support for this organisation who have stuck with us through thick and thin.
My last word is for the parents of the kids who feel that they should vandalise the centre as part of their contribution to saving the site. I think it ironic and highly likely that some of the parents involved have and will in the future use the Centre.
When we win this battle (and win we will) Calne will have the best public sports and leisure facilites in the county provided by our Centre and Beversbrook in association with sports development through JBS and Springfields plus other organisations with whom we are talking.
Please stick with us.
Athena supporter, Calne says...
9:56am Mon 23 Apr 07
as far as im concerned if athena put in another offer im sure it'll be the last as i expected them to walk away this time coz they've been treated so bad by the joke we like to call the district council.i feel we need to support them a bit more than just writing comments on here.i know there are a lot of people writing letters and making phone calls but i think we need to do a bit more as so far nothing has worked.mick and jill have been absolutely fantastic from the very start.does anyone have any ideas on what we can do as a community to make the council realise we want it open as i know there are a lot of people who will support the centre. Good Luck Athena we're all behind you!
Anon, says...
11:04am Mon 23 Apr 07
John wrote:John,
It is without doubt a tragedy that has been allowed to happen to this centre. The blame lies firmly at the feet of NWDC and in particular Delwyn Burbidge and his merry band of idiots. This centre has been allowed to deteriorate over the last 6 years or so, to the sorry state it is in now. The ex member of staff is correct when he says that NWDC were over seeing the NWLL management. of course they were. NWDC were NWDC were paying them £1,000,0000 pa. Burbidge and his merry band are now hiding behind the fact that NWLL was a private company and they had no control and no access to information. In that case why were they handing out millions of pounds of our money to NWLL who don\'t appear to be able tell us where the money went! I would ask Jill Martin and Mick Devonport to push for some sort of investigation into the activities of this shower of incompetent fools. The district council never had any intention of allowing Athena or any other group to run the centre. This was confirmed when the interim manager a DC leisure bod, announced smugly to the staff that Athena would never be allowed to operate from here. The agreement that DC leisure have with the council almost certainly ensures that the centre can never reopen. Why doesn\'t Burbidge and his side kicks come out and be honest for once and tell the truth or has it been so long that this over paid weasel has forgotten what the truth is!!!
A couple of points of fact -
NWLL received £850k
NWDC had a very firm control over NWLL - two NWDC councillors sat on NWLL's Board and two Councilors sat on all Centre Advisotu Committees which reported directly to the NWLL Board.
NWLL had to report every quarter to NWDC on a range of performance indiocators. NWDC then took this report to intially their Exuctive Committee and then latersly POlicy and Scrutinee.
NWDC were fully informed of the position over the six years.
NWLL's funding wss £500k lesds than what NWDC themselves spent on runinng leaiure prior to NWLL being created by NWDC - the grant being reduced year oin year despite riding costs and inflation.
I agree that NWDC should not be allowed to hide. In afinress to the current CEO - he wasnt around when the real danage was done - he is just picking uop the peices. Perhaps his nes assistant , previuously a startegic manager would like to comment as it was her service that was responsible for the contract between NWDC ad NWLL.
Councillors also have to be held accountable -they knew what was going as I ahve previuolst mentioned. If they did not then ot was becasuse they didnt attent meetings or becuase officers oif |NWDC hid it from them.
Kev, Calne says...
1:04pm Mon 23 Apr 07
I think John is absolutly right when he says DC have an agreement with NWDC to never let the WHLC reopen. DC don't want the competition that Athena would bring so they have probably given a nice fat back hander to NWDC.
Thank you to Mike and Jill for all that they have done to try to save White Horse, and also to Athena. I think it is time to ask for a Public Enquiry into what has happened to Calne and the dealings of Delwyn Burridge should be investigated.
I also urge the residents of Calne to use their vote on 3rd of May to oust those councillors that have left us without a leisure centre, maybe if we get a new party in at NWDC their opinions would be different and we could reopen our centre.
Thank you to Mike and Jill for all that they have done to try to save White Horse, and also to Athena. I think it is time to ask for a Public Enquiry into what has happened to Calne and the dealings of Delwyn Burridge should be investigated.
I also urge the residents of Calne to use their vote on 3rd of May to oust those councillors that have left us without a leisure centre, maybe if we get a new party in at NWDC their opinions would be different and we could reopen our centre.
Elaine King, Calne says...
1:12pm Mon 23 Apr 07
I for one am thrilled that Athena still have'nt given Calne up as a bad job! OH, HOW I WISH THEM LUCK!
As someone sarcastically remarked some time ago 'that there are only a handfull of people who want the leisure centre saved and post their comments here" Well I can tell you that everyone I have spoken to all agree that it's disgraceful that the council are even considering closing it. So as far as support for Athena goes, I'm certain that a huge proportion of Calne people will be behind them.
Perhaps it would be a good idea to have petitions in paper form dotted around the town in prominent places like Sainsbury's. Somerfield, the One-Stop shops etc. for those people who have not got internet facilities, to be able to sign a petition.
What say you Mick? I think it can only help.
My 13year old grand-daughter is heartbroken that she and her friends cannot meet up there for the Friday night disco. She said to me "Oh nan, what are we going to do?. There's nowhere for us to go." Out of the mouths of babes eh??!.
As someone sarcastically remarked some time ago 'that there are only a handfull of people who want the leisure centre saved and post their comments here" Well I can tell you that everyone I have spoken to all agree that it's disgraceful that the council are even considering closing it. So as far as support for Athena goes, I'm certain that a huge proportion of Calne people will be behind them.
Perhaps it would be a good idea to have petitions in paper form dotted around the town in prominent places like Sainsbury's. Somerfield, the One-Stop shops etc. for those people who have not got internet facilities, to be able to sign a petition.
What say you Mick? I think it can only help.
My 13year old grand-daughter is heartbroken that she and her friends cannot meet up there for the Friday night disco. She said to me "Oh nan, what are we going to do?. There's nowhere for us to go." Out of the mouths of babes eh??!.
John, Calne says...
6:23pm Mon 23 Apr 07
Thankyou Anon for clarifying some of the issues for me. It doesn't really matter if the grants were £850,000 or £1million the point is that it was mis-managed consistantly for 6 years. In any business you cannot allow it to lose money at that rate year on year without tackling the problem. NWDC did not do the community of North wiltshire any favours by allowing NWLL to continue trading while losing that amount of money. I read earlier that NWLL were given or at least requested another £500,000 at Christmas if this was given then somone needs to be accountable.
I would love to see the centre reopened but I also feel that a lot of questions need to be asked and as you say maybe Laurie Ball needs to answer a few awkward questions.
I would ask, why did NWDC let NWLL continue to trade while losing so much money year on year. Calne leisure centre was driven into its trading position by lack of investment into the fabric of the building and by a school agreement that my 4 year old would not have signed. I feel very strongly that questions need to be asked of the officers and of the councillors that sat on the board
I would love to see the centre reopened but I also feel that a lot of questions need to be asked and as you say maybe Laurie Ball needs to answer a few awkward questions.
I would ask, why did NWDC let NWLL continue to trade while losing so much money year on year. Calne leisure centre was driven into its trading position by lack of investment into the fabric of the building and by a school agreement that my 4 year old would not have signed. I feel very strongly that questions need to be asked of the officers and of the councillors that sat on the board
Concerned resident, Calne says...
7:25pm Mon 23 Apr 07
There Are a number of factors involved with the demise of WHLC:
1. Not enough people used it!! If they did it would be still open.
2. NWDC never invested enough in the fabric of the building. When the pool roof needed replacing NWDC eventually paid for it but never funded the shortfall in income or took it into account.
3. The NWDC councillors who sat on the NWLL board never took any serious interest (half the time they didnt turn up, and it has been said one actually fell asleep in a meeting). For the last 18 months NWDC withdrew them from the board, how the **** did NWDC expect to know what going on!
4. The centre was not the cleanest I have used, for example the sports hall floor always had clumps of fluff lying around and the health suite was covered in body fat.
5. Calne has 2 other facilities, Blacklands and St Marys the latter took away a lot of business and is a far nicer facility.
I could go on but I just wanted to highlight a few things to people. If NWDC have any sense (I do have serious doubts) they will not allow Athena to take over. As a resident I do not wish to fund this facility through my council tax no matter how small a contribution it will be. Keep the centre closed and put more money into the remaining facilities.
1. Not enough people used it!! If they did it would be still open.
2. NWDC never invested enough in the fabric of the building. When the pool roof needed replacing NWDC eventually paid for it but never funded the shortfall in income or took it into account.
3. The NWDC councillors who sat on the NWLL board never took any serious interest (half the time they didnt turn up, and it has been said one actually fell asleep in a meeting). For the last 18 months NWDC withdrew them from the board, how the **** did NWDC expect to know what going on!
4. The centre was not the cleanest I have used, for example the sports hall floor always had clumps of fluff lying around and the health suite was covered in body fat.
5. Calne has 2 other facilities, Blacklands and St Marys the latter took away a lot of business and is a far nicer facility.
I could go on but I just wanted to highlight a few things to people. If NWDC have any sense (I do have serious doubts) they will not allow Athena to take over. As a resident I do not wish to fund this facility through my council tax no matter how small a contribution it will be. Keep the centre closed and put more money into the remaining facilities.
Karen, Calne says...
8:34pm Mon 23 Apr 07
I think the concerned resident is missing some of the points. The council cannot invest in Blacklands or in St Mary's as they are both private concerns. In the same way they cannot invest in anything Athena Leisure are proposing without having some benefit to the community. From what has been said on these pages it seems that the town council are offering £50,000 over 2 years and as for anything that the district are offering, firstly they want it secured and secondly they have to spend that money anyway to secure the building.
If by some miracle the place is opened up again, whoever runs it would have to have a different approach, this would mean well motivated and properly trained staff and a clean facility. Personally I don't object to any of my council tax being spent on providing a good centre where my children as well as myself can enjoy some quality family time.
If by some miracle the place is opened up again, whoever runs it would have to have a different approach, this would mean well motivated and properly trained staff and a clean facility. Personally I don't object to any of my council tax being spent on providing a good centre where my children as well as myself can enjoy some quality family time.
Peter Dolman, Calne says...
8:49pm Mon 23 Apr 07
The facts are quite simple when tenders were sought by NWDC to rescue the White Horse Leisure centre a document was given to all interested parties by the council detailing the minimum requirements needed for a successfull bid. Athena's original plan did not fullfill that minimum requirement. The 2nd submission was a rehash of the 1st and Athena's directors would have been more than aware that it would be unacceptable.
While I have never attended a meeting with Athena's directors I have been given reports by people who have and it does not fill you with confidence. At one meeting an Athena spokesman said "we are not in the business of running leisure centres". Perhaps that could be one of the reasons their bid has fallen well short of the minimal requirements. As a Calne Town councillor I had the benefit of seeing this so called business plan and can say without any qualms that it was one of the worst I have seen, I spent 32 years in finance and have seen many such documents.
I think that the best suggestion logged on this blogg is the foundation of a community trust. If 500 users were prepared to put their money where their mouth is then the centre can be rescued without the involvement of Athena. I am sure that all 3 councils ie Wilts County, North Wilts & Calne Town councils would provide both financial & logistical assistance where possible to such an organisation.
This option would allow all those non Calne Town residents to give financially to the cause and save the centre they their so stridently support.
I am also prepared to discuss my comments with any director of Athena Leisure if they feel they need some advice on how to prepare a business plan.
Peter Dolman
Calne Town Councillor
Lickhill Ward
Liberal Democrat
While I have never attended a meeting with Athena's directors I have been given reports by people who have and it does not fill you with confidence. At one meeting an Athena spokesman said "we are not in the business of running leisure centres". Perhaps that could be one of the reasons their bid has fallen well short of the minimal requirements. As a Calne Town councillor I had the benefit of seeing this so called business plan and can say without any qualms that it was one of the worst I have seen, I spent 32 years in finance and have seen many such documents.
I think that the best suggestion logged on this blogg is the foundation of a community trust. If 500 users were prepared to put their money where their mouth is then the centre can be rescued without the involvement of Athena. I am sure that all 3 councils ie Wilts County, North Wilts & Calne Town councils would provide both financial & logistical assistance where possible to such an organisation.
This option would allow all those non Calne Town residents to give financially to the cause and save the centre they their so stridently support.
I am also prepared to discuss my comments with any director of Athena Leisure if they feel they need some advice on how to prepare a business plan.
Peter Dolman
Calne Town Councillor
Lickhill Ward
Liberal Democrat
Concerned resident, Calne says...
8:53pm Mon 23 Apr 07
I am sorry Karen but I do mind my money being spent on a facility that I will not use. This is my opinion and as much as you may not like it I am entitled to voice it. This forum is not just for supporters but is for anyone with an opinion! Just because you may not agree does not mean that I and other residents should not use this to voice our views. I will never support the re-opening of WHLC and I suspect many other will not as well. it may be tragedy and many people may say that its a shame but if you asked them to do something about it I doubt if many would bother.
John, calne says...
9:18pm Mon 23 Apr 07
Councilor Dolman you do live in a strange world don't you. Didn't you propose the Athena plan and now you attack them yet again.
Why would anyone from Athena want to see you? You are unbelievable.
You should stay in your little shop and out of politics this town can really do without the likes of you.
Why would anyone from Athena want to see you? You are unbelievable.
You should stay in your little shop and out of politics this town can really do without the likes of you.
Karen, calne says...
9:21pm Mon 23 Apr 07
Concerned resident, you've missed the point again. I believe that all points of view are valid and you certainly entitled to voice your opinion on these pages. I along with everyone else welcome your opinion.
Mike, Calne says...
9:54pm Mon 23 Apr 07
Mr Dolman, by all means voice your opinion, but no more than making alternative suggestions. Your continuous barrage of hate against these people is tiresome. If any group ever read some the tripe that you spout then no one would ever invest in Calne. You are without doubt an appalling representative of this town and I dearly hope you don't get re-elected.
Jill and Mick are working hard to try and save this centre, yet you try at every opportunity to undermine thier efforts. Your rediculous suggestion that we could get 500 people to invest in this centre is typical of the nonsense that you continue to spout.
I have had the misfortune of meeting you and I have met Lauchlan Taylor you are not in the same league I'm afraid.
I agree with the previous statement stay in the shallow end and within your depth.
Jill and Mick are working hard to try and save this centre, yet you try at every opportunity to undermine thier efforts. Your rediculous suggestion that we could get 500 people to invest in this centre is typical of the nonsense that you continue to spout.
I have had the misfortune of meeting you and I have met Lauchlan Taylor you are not in the same league I'm afraid.
I agree with the previous statement stay in the shallow end and within your depth.
Penny, Calne says...
10:20pm Mon 23 Apr 07
Even if Athena or anyone else could be persuaded to take on the centre, it must be in such a dreadful state of repair by now.
I think Mick and Jill are doing a fantastic job in trying to save the centre and we should all get behind them. If only Mr Dolman could show a tenth of the committment that they have shown then maybe the centre would not have closed. Personally I doubt that Athena will be able to salvage the centre as it has been left in a dreadful state.
Has anyone heard from Mrs O'gorman and is she doing anything to help reopen the centre?
I think Mick and Jill are doing a fantastic job in trying to save the centre and we should all get behind them. If only Mr Dolman could show a tenth of the committment that they have shown then maybe the centre would not have closed. Personally I doubt that Athena will be able to salvage the centre as it has been left in a dreadful state.
Has anyone heard from Mrs O'gorman and is she doing anything to help reopen the centre?
Local Resident with a Voice, Calne says...
9:41am Tue 24 Apr 07
It is good to see other residents and Councillors with the sense to see through Athena Leisure and their false promises are now recording these on here, rather than the few misguided people who are believing the spin from Athena Leisure. Jill and Mick are well intension but not professionals and like most of you on here are just believing the spin as they don't want to see the centre close. If it isn't being used accept by the 500 people who signed the petition, who I suspect don't actually use the centre, I know of two names on there who are actually members of private centres, which is typical, then the centre should close as it is not represented value for tax payers money, and I would rather see my money used for the benefit of the majority rather than the few who can travel to other centres.
Karen, Calne says...
10:25am Tue 24 Apr 07
Dear Local resident with a voice, I don't think anyone on here is under any illusion as to the state of the centre or what is involved in any rescue plan. I for one have not seen any spin from Athena Leisure, Jill or Mick. Your suggestion that Jill and Mick are well meaning but not professionals is quite offensive. They have approached this project in a very professional manner and have worked with many local groups to try to save a valuable asset for this town. From your comments I would doubt that you have children that need to be ferried to Chippenham for swimming club with minutes to spare.
By all means voice your opinion but don't ridicule those that unselfishly are trying to do what many see as right and talk about spin when there isn't any.
I want my council tax money to be spent wisely but I also want something in return, insisting that I take my children to chippenham for swimming and sports lessons previously available on my doorstep is not offering me value for my money. To suggest that 500 people who signed a petition are not users of the centre is a bold statement especially as you only knew 2 of them!!!
By all means voice your opinion but don't ridicule those that unselfishly are trying to do what many see as right and talk about spin when there isn't any.
I want my council tax money to be spent wisely but I also want something in return, insisting that I take my children to chippenham for swimming and sports lessons previously available on my doorstep is not offering me value for my money. To suggest that 500 people who signed a petition are not users of the centre is a bold statement especially as you only knew 2 of them!!!
Brian Heath, CALNE says...
10:53am Tue 24 Apr 07
It was totally predictable that Athena's latest submission to NWDC would be turned down - not because there was anything wrong with the proposals, but simply because if they were to be accepted the White Horse Leisure Centre might be restored to use, and if that happened the Council would not be able to bank their big fat cheque and bring in the bulldozers. (White Horse Park would be as good a name as any for the new development, which would, as someone suggested earlier, merge in quite nicely with any extension to Tyning Park.)
Athena are to be praised for hanging in there - lesser organisations would have given up long ago. And Mick and Jill are also to be applauded for trying to maintain support for the saving of the Centre. As for Mr Dolman's and other negative comments, they are of no help at all.
Good luck to Athena, I say, but the longer it takes to find a solution, the less liekly it becomes that one will ever be found. Realistically, most of the people who felt they really could not manage without alternative facilities, particularly for swimming, have joined St Marys or some other similar organisation, and therefore their money, which might otherwise have been put into a community trust, is already committed - the Trust idea is not a bad one in theory, but it comes at least two months too late to be practical.
One final point: why does the report which initiated this thread of comments refer only to 'officials' of the NWDC? We elect Councillors to make the important decisions on community matters, and there should have been a full meeting of the whole Council to discuss Athena's latest proposals - it should not have been left to a bunch on useless 'jobs-worths' to reject the plans out of hand. We can get rid of most of the offending councillors on 3rd May, with any luck, but it will take longer to weed out the dead wood from the 'staff' of the NWDC, who always seem to forget that they are there to do the bdding of the elected Councillors, who in turn are there to represent us,'the people'.
If we can keep Athena interested for another couple of moths, maybe a new administration will see things differently, so let's give them our full support and wish them luck.....
Athena are to be praised for hanging in there - lesser organisations would have given up long ago. And Mick and Jill are also to be applauded for trying to maintain support for the saving of the Centre. As for Mr Dolman's and other negative comments, they are of no help at all.
Good luck to Athena, I say, but the longer it takes to find a solution, the less liekly it becomes that one will ever be found. Realistically, most of the people who felt they really could not manage without alternative facilities, particularly for swimming, have joined St Marys or some other similar organisation, and therefore their money, which might otherwise have been put into a community trust, is already committed - the Trust idea is not a bad one in theory, but it comes at least two months too late to be practical.
One final point: why does the report which initiated this thread of comments refer only to 'officials' of the NWDC? We elect Councillors to make the important decisions on community matters, and there should have been a full meeting of the whole Council to discuss Athena's latest proposals - it should not have been left to a bunch on useless 'jobs-worths' to reject the plans out of hand. We can get rid of most of the offending councillors on 3rd May, with any luck, but it will take longer to weed out the dead wood from the 'staff' of the NWDC, who always seem to forget that they are there to do the bdding of the elected Councillors, who in turn are there to represent us,'the people'.
If we can keep Athena interested for another couple of moths, maybe a new administration will see things differently, so let's give them our full support and wish them luck.....
Elaine, Calne says...
12:00pm Tue 24 Apr 07
You seem to have a very strange logic "Mr/s Local Resident with a voice"
How do YOU know that Athena Leisure are using 'spin' to secure the WHLC. Do you honestly believe that Athena Leisure would risk their own funds on a worthless project?
You are giving the impression here that you are 'in the know' about these matters. Well, if you are, don't you think you should share your expertise with the people of Calne so that they will no longer be'misguided' as you choose to call them?
As for your claims that the people who signed the petition do not actually use the centre but belong to private centres, YES, you're correct there, THERE IS NO PUBLIC LEISURE CENTRE IN CALNE FOR PEOPLE TO USE ANY LONGER and yes a lot of people, myself included HAVE joined other private centres out of necessity but that does'nt mean that we don't want the WHLC to stay open and would use that in preference. Besides think of all the additional exhaust fumes contributing to Global Warming by people ferrying themseves and their children to and from other towns-there's no more room in the private Calne centres'
Jill and Mick are doing a fine job and have worked so very hard to keep the WHLC and I for one am solidly behind them.
How do YOU know that Athena Leisure are using 'spin' to secure the WHLC. Do you honestly believe that Athena Leisure would risk their own funds on a worthless project?
You are giving the impression here that you are 'in the know' about these matters. Well, if you are, don't you think you should share your expertise with the people of Calne so that they will no longer be'misguided' as you choose to call them?
As for your claims that the people who signed the petition do not actually use the centre but belong to private centres, YES, you're correct there, THERE IS NO PUBLIC LEISURE CENTRE IN CALNE FOR PEOPLE TO USE ANY LONGER and yes a lot of people, myself included HAVE joined other private centres out of necessity but that does'nt mean that we don't want the WHLC to stay open and would use that in preference. Besides think of all the additional exhaust fumes contributing to Global Warming by people ferrying themseves and their children to and from other towns-there's no more room in the private Calne centres'
Jill and Mick are doing a fine job and have worked so very hard to keep the WHLC and I for one am solidly behind them.
Mick Devonport, Calne says...
1:32pm Tue 24 Apr 07
Thank you to all of our supporters who have left messages here recently. I would also like to thank Cnl Dolman for proposing that CTC pledge £50,000 over the next two years to help towards the Community Charge on the Centre. Incidently Athena have pledged almost the same amount over two years and then will pay the full charge.
My main reason for writing here however is to tell everyone that we have submitted a new plan based on material that NWDC made available to us last week. Although it was a bit late it was very helpful.
My main reason for writing here however is to tell everyone that we have submitted a new plan based on material that NWDC made available to us last week. Although it was a bit late it was very helpful.
John, calne says...
2:53pm Tue 24 Apr 07
Thanks Mick, No spin just facts!! I would also like to thank Cnl Dolman for his support, without his hard work and vision Athena, Mick and Jill may have given up. (I think we all know that the councillor has the vision of Mr McGoo) but thanks anyway! If they are successful I've no doubt that he'll claiming the credit and will forget all the attacks in these pages. If Mr Dolman is so set against Athena why on earth did he propose the grant? anyone know?
Mister X, calne says...
7:30pm Tue 24 Apr 07
My husband and I learnt to swim at the White Horse Leisure Centre and now our children are doing the same. Its an asset that we can not afford to lose.
Peter Dolman, Calne says...
8:52pm Tue 24 Apr 07
I did not propose to support Athena Leisure the resolution was to support any bid acceptable to North Wilts District Council. My prefered option is still a community trust operating on a non profit making basis. I do not see why a leisure centre should be profitable and I have no problem with a small annual grant from the Town Council, but in general terms I do not see long term support being given to a private limited company whose shareholders quite rightly will expect a return on their investments.
With the £50k from CTC & £60k from NWDC a community trust already has a considerable amount of financial backing available. If then denbentures were sold, allowing discounts to access services, to the general public then given the ammount of support it should be feasible to raise a futher £100k (200 x £500). As a community trust you can obtain relief from rates and it may be exempt from vat.
It's not too late for a committee to be formed and a constitution agreed.
Peter Dolman
Calne Town Councillor
Lickhill Ward
Liberal Democrat
With the £50k from CTC & £60k from NWDC a community trust already has a considerable amount of financial backing available. If then denbentures were sold, allowing discounts to access services, to the general public then given the ammount of support it should be feasible to raise a futher £100k (200 x £500). As a community trust you can obtain relief from rates and it may be exempt from vat.
It's not too late for a committee to be formed and a constitution agreed.
Peter Dolman
Calne Town Councillor
Lickhill Ward
Liberal Democrat
ex employee, Calne says...
9:56pm Tue 24 Apr 07
Not a bad idea Mr Dolman, why haven't you tried to get this going? The one obstacle I can guarantee you is that with you were involved none of the old staff would return, it may not be anyones idea of a career working for DC but it would be better than working with you. When this place was open all you ever did and continue to do is criticise anyone and anything that didn't come from your mixed up brain. You were always rude to the staff no matter what we did. If athena are successful I hope they manage to keep you out. If thats the case then we'll all come back! As somone said before with any luck you won't get reelcted and we can see the back of you for good.
alan, bryan\'s close rd calne says...
10:26pm Tue 24 Apr 07
IT'S GOOD NEWS THAT ATHENA THAS PUT IN A NEW BID TO SAVE THE CENTER,BUT WE KNOW THAT TIME IS RUNNING OUT.WE NEED ACTION AND NOT COMMENTS.TO SAVE WHLC THE LONGER ALL THIS PUTTING IN BIDS THE MORE THE WHLC COULD BE VANDALIZED AND WILL FALL INTO DISREPAIRE.MR DOLMAN SHOULD SPEAK TO JILL AND MIKE + ATHENA AND THIS SHOULD BE HIS FIRST PRIORITY.ATHENA WILL BE IN THE LONG TERM GOOD FOR CALNE SO SUPPORT THEM
Another ex-employee, Calne says...
6:41am Wed 25 Apr 07
As an ex employee of WHLC and NWLL I for one would not return to the centre. I am happy with my new job in DC Leisure and can not see any way Athena can be a success. There was imply not enough support leading up to the closure.
angie easton, calne says...
1:12pm Wed 25 Apr 07
There was the support there but 'we' the users thought that it would never close beause we had an interested party that wanted to take it over, ie Athena leisure! yes and guess what they still do want to take it over.
Had the council just wanted it closed and there was no plan B,I think you would have been very suprised at the support the centre would of got from the 'users'.
I for one have joined a private centre. but wouldn't hesitate in changing back. for the simple reason my children cant use it.
Exellent news from Athena- GOOD LUCK, & thanks to Mick & Jill
again for all they have done so far!
Had the council just wanted it closed and there was no plan B,I think you would have been very suprised at the support the centre would of got from the 'users'.
I for one have joined a private centre. but wouldn't hesitate in changing back. for the simple reason my children cant use it.
Exellent news from Athena- GOOD LUCK, & thanks to Mick & Jill
again for all they have done so far!
Resident with a Voice, Calne says...
3:09pm Wed 25 Apr 07
The sooner you all get some lives the better. You people would believe Xmas was coming at the weekend, if Athena Leisure said so, but the simple fact is it isn't. The facts are the facts and anyone that has attended any of the public meetings with Athena Leisure would understand they are all smoke and mirrors. I would challenge Athena Leisure to submit their business plan onto this website, so we can all see it for ourselves, along with the letter John is referring to from the Council so we can all use our own brain power to determine what the truth actually is, the statement on the Council's website says it all. http://www.northwilts.gov.uk/index/newsdesk/news_hot_topics/leisureupdate.htm I for one do not believe half the rubbish, which seems to be put on here from the same selection of people day in and day out wanting to save the centre. As I have said before, residents knew before Xmas that the centre was earmarked for closure so what happened to all the residents rushing out at that point and using the centre to prove it is needed, no doubt they were all sat online reading this website.
John Richards, Lacock says...
5:57pm Wed 25 Apr 07
Resident with a Voice. Firstly there appears to be a whole range of people on this site, many in support and a few like you against saving the centre. All entitled to voice an opinion regardless of other peoples views. You have emailed in many times and repeated your views constantly throughout. However you seem to have run out of arguments and reverted to attacking the many people who have emailed different opinions to that of your own. I was at the meeting at WHLC when Athena spoke and as I recall there was a lot of support apart from 2 people, who were clearly against anyone running the centre. From what I am told Athena Leisure have not made any statements other than to confirm that a proposal has been submitted through Mick and Jill and together they have developed a business plan. The council do not have to accept it nobody does. You seem to be saying that these people are trying to pull the wool of my eyes, if thats all they have said then, this isn't the case. To suggest that the population were sat at home on their computers is childish, you really are clutching at straws.
All we can do is wait to hear from Mick and Jill to see if Athenas proposal is acceptable, if not you can cheer from the roof tops, but please don't insult us.
All we can do is wait to hear from Mick and Jill to see if Athenas proposal is acceptable, if not you can cheer from the roof tops, but please don't insult us.
angie easton, calne says...
7:33pm Wed 25 Apr 07
resident with a voice.I have to ask, do you work for dc leisure or may be another local leisure centre? It strikes me you dont want calne to re-opened, is that because you dont want the competion? and if were all so sad sat at home on our pc's, then what does that make you? and for your information before whlc closed I and my family were there 5 times a week,
at the gym, pool and classes.
at the gym, pool and classes.
John, calne says...
9:17pm Wed 25 Apr 07
Resident with a voice. I agree with Angie you almost certainly have a connection or an interest in DC leisure.
This doesn't matter to me as DC leisures only interest in Calne was to see it shut this has been successful and they must be feeling quite smug. Although I'm certain that NWDC will go to any length to protect their new partners, I still hope that Athena will be successful and then that will give you and Mr Dolman an opportunity to run them down no matter what they do. Everyone should remember that there were many people using the centre, in particular the pool. The swimming club was one of the most popular in the county. As the centre became tired and lacking in investment people stopped using it in the numbers they had previously.
Lets face it the ladies changing for the pool would have failed any health inspection. If NWDC could have been persuaded to invest in upgrading the centre then people would use it again.
Good luck to Mick and Jill at least they have tried
This doesn't matter to me as DC leisures only interest in Calne was to see it shut this has been successful and they must be feeling quite smug. Although I'm certain that NWDC will go to any length to protect their new partners, I still hope that Athena will be successful and then that will give you and Mr Dolman an opportunity to run them down no matter what they do. Everyone should remember that there were many people using the centre, in particular the pool. The swimming club was one of the most popular in the county. As the centre became tired and lacking in investment people stopped using it in the numbers they had previously.
Lets face it the ladies changing for the pool would have failed any health inspection. If NWDC could have been persuaded to invest in upgrading the centre then people would use it again.
Good luck to Mick and Jill at least they have tried
Julie Lovelock, Calne says...
10:24pm Wed 25 Apr 07
I didn't think I would be recording any other comments here as I thought Athena Leisure would have walked away from after the last rejection - but maybe not?
What is the matter with you people? All this argee bargee about not wanting to pay for re-opening the centre in your council tax - have NWDC reduced your council tax now because they've closed WHLC?
OK the centre wasn't drawing in enough people (according to NWDC figures anyway), but WHLC still had to contribute to NWLL corporate funds and what did it get in return? How successful was the marketing? If the centre was allowed to operate under its own steam then there wouldn't be the same problems in getting its 'slice of the cake'.
I'm not one of those who has chosen to go to a private centre and I'm still using the DC leisure facilities (oh dear!), but as I work mainly in Bath and Swindon I'm trying to do classes on the way home from work, but I'd go back to the WHLC tomorrow if it opened up again.
Whether you used the centre in the past or not, the whole point is that now you can't have the option to use it in the future.
Its like a self fulfilling prophecy - when the initial statement was made that 3 centres were closing my husband said - "you watch Calne will be the only one to close".
How is this town ever going to climb out of this pit that we find ourselves in? All we seem to be good for is providing cheaper housing than Chippenham or Swindon - is there nobody who seems interested in putting anything back into the town?
I'm just as guilty in many ways as now I'm going to Chippenham on Fridays to the Olympiad then I'm doing my bits and pieces of shopping in Chippenham as well - so Calne is losing out again.
Everybody is thinking in terms of the centre being the same if it were to re-open, but perhaps it would be very different and a whole lot better. If Athena are still around I applaud them and I think they have shown a solid commitment to the people of Calne and do not deserve the labels of fools and charlatans that some seem eager to apply to them. And sadly, what have we done to show Athena that we deserve this commitment?
What is the matter with you people? All this argee bargee about not wanting to pay for re-opening the centre in your council tax - have NWDC reduced your council tax now because they've closed WHLC?
OK the centre wasn't drawing in enough people (according to NWDC figures anyway), but WHLC still had to contribute to NWLL corporate funds and what did it get in return? How successful was the marketing? If the centre was allowed to operate under its own steam then there wouldn't be the same problems in getting its 'slice of the cake'.
I'm not one of those who has chosen to go to a private centre and I'm still using the DC leisure facilities (oh dear!), but as I work mainly in Bath and Swindon I'm trying to do classes on the way home from work, but I'd go back to the WHLC tomorrow if it opened up again.
Whether you used the centre in the past or not, the whole point is that now you can't have the option to use it in the future.
Its like a self fulfilling prophecy - when the initial statement was made that 3 centres were closing my husband said - "you watch Calne will be the only one to close".
How is this town ever going to climb out of this pit that we find ourselves in? All we seem to be good for is providing cheaper housing than Chippenham or Swindon - is there nobody who seems interested in putting anything back into the town?
I'm just as guilty in many ways as now I'm going to Chippenham on Fridays to the Olympiad then I'm doing my bits and pieces of shopping in Chippenham as well - so Calne is losing out again.
Everybody is thinking in terms of the centre being the same if it were to re-open, but perhaps it would be very different and a whole lot better. If Athena are still around I applaud them and I think they have shown a solid commitment to the people of Calne and do not deserve the labels of fools and charlatans that some seem eager to apply to them. And sadly, what have we done to show Athena that we deserve this commitment?
Peter Dolman, Calne says...
10:49pm Wed 25 Apr 07
I have tried to give factual and unbiased comment on this sad state of affairs and I am more than aware of the emotions involved. I think that time will tell whose point of view is nearer the truth. I would very much like to see the leisure centre reopen but I don't see the Athena business plan providing a viable way forward, I would not be unhappy if I am wrong.
The debate has been running long enough and we should all leave it to Athena and NWDC TO thrash out a plan if at all possible,
Peter Dolman
Calne Town Councillor
Liberal Democrat
The debate has been running long enough and we should all leave it to Athena and NWDC TO thrash out a plan if at all possible,
Peter Dolman
Calne Town Councillor
Liberal Democrat
mister x's kid, calne says...
12:41pm Thu 26 Apr 07
I learn't to swim at the sports centre and at John bentley i do GCSE P. E. The sports centre is very important for my learning and leisure and it is a massive loss to the school disrupting young kids learning. I think Mr. Dolman should pull his finger out and realise that the leisure centre should be open for the good of all the town.
Mister X's kid
Mister X's kid
Calne Resident, says...
6:19pm Thu 26 Apr 07
According to a friend of mine using the D C Leisure facilities just this morning, the hot topic of conversation was that Persimmon had put an offer in the council for the land at the White Horse Leisure Centre - and guess what for! White Horse Way beckons.......
alan, calne says...
11:52pm Thu 26 Apr 07
now we know why nwdc keep on rejecting athena leisure,persimmon homes wont the land.if all go's down the pan,can athena with the town council
build a new centre with pool on the beaversbrook site.
alan
build a new centre with pool on the beaversbrook site.
alan
Brian Heath, Calne says...
11:17am Fri 27 Apr 07
If you look back over some of the comments which I and others have left on this site, in connection with this and several previous articles about the closure of Calne's White Horse Leisure Centre, we have already said many times that NWDC had no desire to keep the centre open, because it already had developers standing by with big fat cheques and half a dozen bulldozers ready to move on to the site. It was obvious, right from the start, and now it looks, if this report is to be believed, that we were right.
I have just sent an email to North Wiltshire District Council, which I paraphrase below for anyone who may wish to follow suit:
"I have CANCELLED the Direct Debit Mandate under which you were due to take £127 per month from 1st May 2007 until 1st January 2008.
I have REPLACED the Direct Debit with a STANDING ORDER for the payment of £125 per month on the 15th of every month from May 2007 to January 2008 inclusive.
This change is made as a protest against the closure, on 31st March 2007, of the White Horse Leisure Centre in Calne, as a direct result of North Wiltshire District Council's mismanagement and incompetence, its lack of supervision of its puppet company North Wiltshire Leisure Limited, and its subsequent obstinate blocking of any and all proposals, principally from Athena Leisure, which could and probaly would have saved the Centre from closure or allowed it to re-open very quickly.
"The change of date from the 1st to the 15th of each month is a protest against the Council's arbitrary decision to deprive me of the use of my own money for two weeks of every month, without consultation and, I suspect, contrary to law. (How many of you spotted this bringing-forward of the payment dates? The extra revenue that NWDC's own blurb estimated this would bring in would have been enough to save the Leisure Centre! BH)
"Let me make it perfectly clear that I am not saying that I will never pay the Council Tax I am now withholding: as soon as the White Horse Leisure Centre is open and fully functional again I will cancel the Standing Order and reinstate the Direct Debit - this will then allow you (NWDC) to collect any arrears at that time. But for as long as the White Horse Leisure Centre remains closed to the public, I plan to pay a reduced rate of Council Tax, on the grounds that I do not ever, as a matter of principle, pay for services which I do not receive. As soon as normal service is resumed at the Centre I shall pay off the withheld portion of the tax and resume my monthly payments as usual"
If enough other people do the same as I have done, it is just vaguely possible that NWDC might be prepared to pay some attention to the feelings and opinions of Calne people in regard to our Leisure Centre.
By the way, voters in the Calne Lickhill ward should carefully note that Councillor Peter Dolman is one of SIX candidates fighting for TWO seats on the District Council in the local elections next Thursday, 3rd May. You may think it worthwhile to make sure you cast your vote, for two of the alternative candidates, to make sure he and his LibDem colleagues get no further chance to run Calne into the ground!
I have just sent an email to North Wiltshire District Council, which I paraphrase below for anyone who may wish to follow suit:
"I have CANCELLED the Direct Debit Mandate under which you were due to take £127 per month from 1st May 2007 until 1st January 2008.
I have REPLACED the Direct Debit with a STANDING ORDER for the payment of £125 per month on the 15th of every month from May 2007 to January 2008 inclusive.
This change is made as a protest against the closure, on 31st March 2007, of the White Horse Leisure Centre in Calne, as a direct result of North Wiltshire District Council's mismanagement and incompetence, its lack of supervision of its puppet company North Wiltshire Leisure Limited, and its subsequent obstinate blocking of any and all proposals, principally from Athena Leisure, which could and probaly would have saved the Centre from closure or allowed it to re-open very quickly.
"The change of date from the 1st to the 15th of each month is a protest against the Council's arbitrary decision to deprive me of the use of my own money for two weeks of every month, without consultation and, I suspect, contrary to law. (How many of you spotted this bringing-forward of the payment dates? The extra revenue that NWDC's own blurb estimated this would bring in would have been enough to save the Leisure Centre! BH)
"Let me make it perfectly clear that I am not saying that I will never pay the Council Tax I am now withholding: as soon as the White Horse Leisure Centre is open and fully functional again I will cancel the Standing Order and reinstate the Direct Debit - this will then allow you (NWDC) to collect any arrears at that time. But for as long as the White Horse Leisure Centre remains closed to the public, I plan to pay a reduced rate of Council Tax, on the grounds that I do not ever, as a matter of principle, pay for services which I do not receive. As soon as normal service is resumed at the Centre I shall pay off the withheld portion of the tax and resume my monthly payments as usual"
If enough other people do the same as I have done, it is just vaguely possible that NWDC might be prepared to pay some attention to the feelings and opinions of Calne people in regard to our Leisure Centre.
By the way, voters in the Calne Lickhill ward should carefully note that Councillor Peter Dolman is one of SIX candidates fighting for TWO seats on the District Council in the local elections next Thursday, 3rd May. You may think it worthwhile to make sure you cast your vote, for two of the alternative candidates, to make sure he and his LibDem colleagues get no further chance to run Calne into the ground!
angie, calne says...
1:09pm Fri 27 Apr 07
well said brian! hubby and I are in total agreement, emailing NWDC now!
Like you say, if we all do it, it will have real impact!
Like you say, if we all do it, it will have real impact!
Tim, Melksham, Chippenham, Calne, Trowbridge,Bromham, Kington-St Michael says...
1:41pm Fri 27 Apr 07
Submitted on behalf of Not Quite So Young FC
Over the past few weeks, I have read with great interest the comments on this site and it is pleasing to see that so many people are passionate about the future of the WHLC. What is more pleasing is that a small group are personally committed to fight this to a hopefully positive conclusion. Included in the group must be the Athena team because I know that I would have walked away long ago if I had been knocked back repeatedly. We should also appreciate that public authorities have strict guidelines to follow and are probably not totally to blame (if at all) in all of this. What would be good is to see them all around the table to understand fully what conditions are not being met and for all parties to hear the same version of the truth.
We are a group of mature men who have used the centre for over 25 years playing five-a-side football. Over that period, many of us have used the swimming pool and gym when rehabilitating from injuries. We have also brought our families to use the facilities. We have seen staff come and go, we have seen managers come and go, we have seen owners come and go. The one thing we have most definitely noticed is the lack of investment over at least the last ten years. That is history and we can do nothing about that. It must be difficult for the Calne community to understand why ultimately the WHLC is the only centre to close, when two others were earmarked for closure in the original decision.
It is only to be expected that the sceptics amongst us will be looking at the housing estate creeping ever closer to the school grounds, and wondering whether the facilities will be bulldozed to make way for further development.
Many comments have been posted dealing with Government initiatives dealing with walking to school, obesity, PE time in schools, all primary children to leave for secondary school being able to swim at least a width, not to mention the environmental impact of driving further distances to get to a sports centre.
A major challenge should we succeed in re-opening the centre is to win back those who have made alternative arrangements, bearing in mind that we might go through all this again some time in the future.
The subject of putting our money where our mouth is, is an interesting one and is something our group would definitely consider. We invested about £1800 per year in the centre over a year through hiring the hall. Dont tell our partners, but we probably invested four times as much as that in the bar!! We have had some great times at the centre over the years and we are hopeful that we can continue to do so if the centre re-opens. I have no doubt that our group would cough up £1000 to be put into some sort of trust if that is what it takes.
An interesting point as far as our group is concerned is that over the past six or seven years, we almost felt as though the powers to be were trying to oust us from our block booking by imposing forms of sanctions on us. At one time we were all required to become members of the centre we did this. We were then required to be affiliated to the Wilts FA we did this. We were then required to have our own insurance we did this. Interestingly, when we have played at other centres since the closure, we have not had to do meet any requirements. Undoubtedly the worst moment was when the bar was closed one evening! Luckily we reverted to plan B and sought refreshment elsewhere. We have had to suffer the continuing failure and humiliation of the England team to win anything; watching through snowy TV screens with one of us standing patiently holding the TV aerial. The amazing thing throughout the 25 years is that all of us knew that we could turn up at our allotted time, and there would be a game for us. Whether there were 8 of us or 16 of us. I wont even mention the countless social events we have organised through our long lasting association.
Thats probably enough from me, so please, please, please dont give up on the centre and spread the word to whoever wants to join in the fight to save the centre. One last thing I think its a bit petty having a go at an individual just because they have an opinion that doesnt match your own.
Over the past few weeks, I have read with great interest the comments on this site and it is pleasing to see that so many people are passionate about the future of the WHLC. What is more pleasing is that a small group are personally committed to fight this to a hopefully positive conclusion. Included in the group must be the Athena team because I know that I would have walked away long ago if I had been knocked back repeatedly. We should also appreciate that public authorities have strict guidelines to follow and are probably not totally to blame (if at all) in all of this. What would be good is to see them all around the table to understand fully what conditions are not being met and for all parties to hear the same version of the truth.
We are a group of mature men who have used the centre for over 25 years playing five-a-side football. Over that period, many of us have used the swimming pool and gym when rehabilitating from injuries. We have also brought our families to use the facilities. We have seen staff come and go, we have seen managers come and go, we have seen owners come and go. The one thing we have most definitely noticed is the lack of investment over at least the last ten years. That is history and we can do nothing about that. It must be difficult for the Calne community to understand why ultimately the WHLC is the only centre to close, when two others were earmarked for closure in the original decision.
It is only to be expected that the sceptics amongst us will be looking at the housing estate creeping ever closer to the school grounds, and wondering whether the facilities will be bulldozed to make way for further development.
Many comments have been posted dealing with Government initiatives dealing with walking to school, obesity, PE time in schools, all primary children to leave for secondary school being able to swim at least a width, not to mention the environmental impact of driving further distances to get to a sports centre.
A major challenge should we succeed in re-opening the centre is to win back those who have made alternative arrangements, bearing in mind that we might go through all this again some time in the future.
The subject of putting our money where our mouth is, is an interesting one and is something our group would definitely consider. We invested about £1800 per year in the centre over a year through hiring the hall. Dont tell our partners, but we probably invested four times as much as that in the bar!! We have had some great times at the centre over the years and we are hopeful that we can continue to do so if the centre re-opens. I have no doubt that our group would cough up £1000 to be put into some sort of trust if that is what it takes.
An interesting point as far as our group is concerned is that over the past six or seven years, we almost felt as though the powers to be were trying to oust us from our block booking by imposing forms of sanctions on us. At one time we were all required to become members of the centre we did this. We were then required to be affiliated to the Wilts FA we did this. We were then required to have our own insurance we did this. Interestingly, when we have played at other centres since the closure, we have not had to do meet any requirements. Undoubtedly the worst moment was when the bar was closed one evening! Luckily we reverted to plan B and sought refreshment elsewhere. We have had to suffer the continuing failure and humiliation of the England team to win anything; watching through snowy TV screens with one of us standing patiently holding the TV aerial. The amazing thing throughout the 25 years is that all of us knew that we could turn up at our allotted time, and there would be a game for us. Whether there were 8 of us or 16 of us. I wont even mention the countless social events we have organised through our long lasting association.
Thats probably enough from me, so please, please, please dont give up on the centre and spread the word to whoever wants to join in the fight to save the centre. One last thing I think its a bit petty having a go at an individual just because they have an opinion that doesnt match your own.
Elaine King, Calne says...
7:20pm Fri 27 Apr 07
It would'nt surprise me in the least to learn that NWDC had a 'Done Deal' with a developer but whatever the hidden agenda turns out to be, I will never vote for a Liberal council again and told them so when they came canvassing at my door in the week, asking me to put a poster up in our window!
NWDC did write to inform us (not ask us) that in future they would be taking the Community Charge money from our bank account on the 1st of every month instead of the 15th as has normally been the case.
The early payment, they said, would net the Council an extra £50,000 ahead of time.
Now, if they were contemplating using that money to restore the Leisure Centre to the community, I'd be more than happy to concur.
BUT - as a protest against their complete disregard for the wishes of the people, I too have joined others in cancelling our £127pm Direct Debit and replaced it with a Standing Order for £125.p.m.
I too will pay the withheld tax and reinstate the Direct Debit when our town once again has a Leisure Centre.
NWDC did write to inform us (not ask us) that in future they would be taking the Community Charge money from our bank account on the 1st of every month instead of the 15th as has normally been the case.
The early payment, they said, would net the Council an extra £50,000 ahead of time.
Now, if they were contemplating using that money to restore the Leisure Centre to the community, I'd be more than happy to concur.
BUT - as a protest against their complete disregard for the wishes of the people, I too have joined others in cancelling our £127pm Direct Debit and replaced it with a Standing Order for £125.p.m.
I too will pay the withheld tax and reinstate the Direct Debit when our town once again has a Leisure Centre.
alan, calne says...
11:04pm Fri 27 Apr 07
don t understand about the difference between direct debit and to change to standing order can anyone please explain many thanks alan
Julie Lovelock, Calne says...
10:01am Sat 28 Apr 07
I just read the comment from Tim about the 5 a side football team and I must say it gave me a real boost as this just illustrates what the centre was all about. How great to hear about the commitment to the centre and what fun and enjoyment it must have given through the years and I also noted most of the individuals were not actually residents of the town. Again this just shows up all those ridiculous statistics that we've had quoted to us about less than 2% of the population were users of the WHLC - the WHLC had a real impact on real people's lives. I have to say that I've now succumbed to the need of joining a private centre as I felt I was running myself into the ground trying to dash around to all the local DC Leisure sites - I thought this would be totally unsustainable by the time we get to the winter months, but I am only committed to a 6 month period so I haven't given up on the WHLC yet.
Interesting to note was that when I visited The Olympiad recently there is a lot of work being done to the reception area and I understand that this work has been urgently funded by NWDC (not DC Leisure) and has to be completed by next week - just in time for the local elections!!!
Interesting to note was that when I visited The Olympiad recently there is a lot of work being done to the reception area and I understand that this work has been urgently funded by NWDC (not DC Leisure) and has to be completed by next week - just in time for the local elections!!!
anon, says...
11:42pm Sat 28 Apr 07
alan wrote:a direct debit will allow NWDC to collect your full monthly council tax payment but by replacing this with a standing order you will specify the amount you are willing to pay, therefore enabling you to withhold part of your council tax if you choose.
don t understand about the difference between direct debit and to change to standing order can anyone please explain many thanks alan
not very happy, calne - ish says...
10:21pm Sun 29 Apr 07
From what I heard from a friend last night the WHLC will soon be a fully fledged 'knokking shop' - there's plenty of people 'practising' there!
Weren't we all certain the site would be vandalised etc? - YES! Did WCC get to the site as soon as the doors were closed to secure the building? - NO! Easter Holidays came first - two weeks for the 'vandals' to run amok! - or was this part of the plan (probably to save NWDC some of the costs on demolition!) Now to top it all - Calne Alpha Four Swimming Squad (not Synchronised Swimming ) will cease to be -they can't get their 'water time' for which they paid thousands of pounds each year in other pools in North Wiltshire - so much for NWDC's capacity planning. Thank heaven NWDC doesn't own a brewery - we'd all be teetotal within days!
Weren't we all certain the site would be vandalised etc? - YES! Did WCC get to the site as soon as the doors were closed to secure the building? - NO! Easter Holidays came first - two weeks for the 'vandals' to run amok! - or was this part of the plan (probably to save NWDC some of the costs on demolition!) Now to top it all - Calne Alpha Four Swimming Squad (not Synchronised Swimming ) will cease to be -they can't get their 'water time' for which they paid thousands of pounds each year in other pools in North Wiltshire - so much for NWDC's capacity planning. Thank heaven NWDC doesn't own a brewery - we'd all be teetotal within days!
Mike, Calne says...
8:59am Tue 1 May 07
any news anyone?not that im expecting good news of course but just an update on what the council have done this time with Athena's plan?mick are you out there?!
Brian Heath, Calne says...
10:49am Tue 1 May 07
Just to clarify the reply from 'anon' to Alan's query about the difference between a Direct Debit and a Standing Order:
A Direct Debit authorises the beneficiary (let's call them the NWDC!) to take from your bank account, UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE, whatever sum of money they deem to be due, as long as they tell you in advance how much they plan to take. So once you've signed it, NWDC can take, say, £127 a month this year, £135 a month next year, and so on - just by sending you your Council Taxt bill each March.
A Standing Order instructs your bank to pay to NWDC a fixed sum of money per momnth for a fixed period of time, so if, next year, NWDC wanted to increase your council tax, you would have to specifically authorise your bank to pay the increase.
In effect, a Standing Order gives you a lot more control over how much is paid and for how long. But you have to keep remembering to tell the bank whenever you want to change the amount or duration of the payments. So a Direct Debit is more convenient, requiring no further contact with the bank from the day you sign it until you finally decide to cancel it, but it allows NWDC, for instance, to take ever-increasing amounts per month without interference.
So now you know, why don't a few more of you join in the protest? Thanks to those who have already followed my example, but it will take a lot more to have any real impact.
A Direct Debit authorises the beneficiary (let's call them the NWDC!) to take from your bank account, UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE, whatever sum of money they deem to be due, as long as they tell you in advance how much they plan to take. So once you've signed it, NWDC can take, say, £127 a month this year, £135 a month next year, and so on - just by sending you your Council Taxt bill each March.
A Standing Order instructs your bank to pay to NWDC a fixed sum of money per momnth for a fixed period of time, so if, next year, NWDC wanted to increase your council tax, you would have to specifically authorise your bank to pay the increase.
In effect, a Standing Order gives you a lot more control over how much is paid and for how long. But you have to keep remembering to tell the bank whenever you want to change the amount or duration of the payments. So a Direct Debit is more convenient, requiring no further contact with the bank from the day you sign it until you finally decide to cancel it, but it allows NWDC, for instance, to take ever-increasing amounts per month without interference.
So now you know, why don't a few more of you join in the protest? Thanks to those who have already followed my example, but it will take a lot more to have any real impact.
Athena Leisure, Doncaster says...
11:15am Wed 2 May 07
STATEMENT BY ATHENA LEISURE
As the people of Calne are aware we have over the last few months been in discussion with Representatives of the NWDC in relation to proposing a business plan for the continuance of the usage of the White Horse leisure Centre by the Local Community.
We have now been informed by the NWDC that our latest proposal has again been rejected and in consequence and having given the matter detailed consideration Athena Leisure has decided it is not in the interests of the community to protract the matter any further and must therefore accept that our efforts to save the Centre regretfully must now come to a conclusion.
We thank all those within the community and those members of the Town Council who have supported our efforts to save the centre and in allowing us the opportunity of putting forward our proposals for the continuance of the Centre in the provision of sporting activities rather than its permanent closure.
We would particularly like to thank Jill Martin and Mick Davenport of the Calne Community Partnership for their unstinting support and efforts in representing the community and assisting us throughout with our discussions with the NWDC.
The reasons given by NWDC in their own words are as follows:
No guarantor for the £60,000 loan
There is no staff to TUPE all staff have been re-deployed or made
redundant on 31st March 2007.
Any reopening of the Centre would lead to claims being made by
ex-employees.
Not indemnifying the Council against future claims from former employees
of NWLL made redundant.
Lack of clarity concerning ongoing maintenance and improvements to
the building and operational machinery.
The building is now under license to John Bentley School. A review of the license would be subject to the board of governors.
As the people of Calne are aware we have over the last few months been in discussion with Representatives of the NWDC in relation to proposing a business plan for the continuance of the usage of the White Horse leisure Centre by the Local Community.
We have now been informed by the NWDC that our latest proposal has again been rejected and in consequence and having given the matter detailed consideration Athena Leisure has decided it is not in the interests of the community to protract the matter any further and must therefore accept that our efforts to save the Centre regretfully must now come to a conclusion.
We thank all those within the community and those members of the Town Council who have supported our efforts to save the centre and in allowing us the opportunity of putting forward our proposals for the continuance of the Centre in the provision of sporting activities rather than its permanent closure.
We would particularly like to thank Jill Martin and Mick Davenport of the Calne Community Partnership for their unstinting support and efforts in representing the community and assisting us throughout with our discussions with the NWDC.
The reasons given by NWDC in their own words are as follows:
No guarantor for the £60,000 loan
There is no staff to TUPE all staff have been re-deployed or made
redundant on 31st March 2007.
Any reopening of the Centre would lead to claims being made by
ex-employees.
Not indemnifying the Council against future claims from former employees
of NWLL made redundant.
Lack of clarity concerning ongoing maintenance and improvements to
the building and operational machinery.
The building is now under license to John Bentley School. A review of the license would be subject to the board of governors.
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angry, calne says...
2:23pm Thu 19 Apr 07