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Yet another twist in flag saga
Campaigners who thought they had won their eight-month battle to see the union flag flown from Calne Town Hall have been faced with a new obstacle.
Councillors agreed on July 7 to hand over control to members of the Royal British Legion subject to town clerk Linda Roberts investigating health and safety implications.
Mrs Roberts has now released her report, which has been slammed by members of the RBL.
In the report Mrs Roberts writes: "The physical and psychological well-being of anyone seeking permission to gain access to the roof should be considered.
"Anyone with the following conditions should be excludedheart problems, asthma, stroke, high or low blood pressure, fear of heights, depression."
The report rules out RBL members signing a waiver, claiming these "are not considered worth the paper they are written on."
She suggests an alternative, asking: "Is it necessary for the flag to be flown from the town hall roof?
The report continues: "For example a flagpole located elsewhere in the town, or affixed to the side of the building, similar to those at the Lansdowne Strand Hotel (would the Lansdowne Strand Hotel consider permitted (sic) the Legion to use one of their flagpoles -it is believe (sic) the owner is an Ex-Army person."
Campaigner Paul Mayo said: "It's as if the council originally suggested this just to shut us up. The report is ridiculous and flying the flag from the Lansdowne is not what we set out to do."
1:26pm Thursday 24th July 2008
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CommentPosted by: msmith134, Calne on 1:39pm Thu 24 Jul 08
I am a 39 asthmatic, fitter than most and would like Linda Roberts to meet me and explain why I cannot hoist a flag of the town roof.
I am a 39 asthmatic, fitter than most and would like Linda Roberts to meet me and explain why I cannot hoist a flag of the town roof.
Posted by: Paul Mayo, Calne on 2:34pm Thu 24 Jul 08
To be fair, Linda and her staff are caught in the middle of this issue, trying to do what they can to best execute decisions made by Calne’s elected Councillors. Linda’s report simply outlines her research into the points that needed to be considered before the Councillors resolution can be implemented (from a legal and a H&S perspective). The real issue surely lies with why Cllr Viner tabled this particular motion. Either he hadn’t checked the feasibility of what he was suggesting (which would surely be improvident) or he did check and knew that the resolution would be nigh on impossible to implement. The townsfolk of Calne elected their Councillors to represent them and, on this issue, some of Calne’s wards appear to have been let down.
To be fair, Linda and her staff are caught in the middle of this issue, trying to do what they can to best execute decisions made by Calne’s elected Councillors. Linda’s report simply outlines her research into the points that needed to be considered before the Councillors resolution can be implemented (from a legal and a H&S perspective). The real issue surely lies with why Cllr Viner tabled this particular motion. Either he hadn’t checked the feasibility of what he was suggesting (which would surely be improvident) or he did check and knew that the resolution would be nigh on impossible to implement. The townsfolk of Calne elected their Councillors to represent them and, on this issue, some of Calne’s wards appear to have been let down.
Posted by: who dat? on 9:59pm Thu 24 Jul 08
Sack [bold]ALL[/bold] jobsworths!
Posted by: Joe, Wilts on 11:43pm Thu 24 Jul 08
This situation with the flag really is becoming a farce.
This situation with the flag really is becoming a farce.
Posted by: Ian Armstrong, England on 6:33am Fri 25 Jul 08
This sorry saga has become very sad. What started as a simple request for the Union Flag to be flown over the Town Hall, has degenerated into the council being left looking petty and foolish. If raising the flag carries such risk, does this merit an investigation into how the flag was flown in the past?
I hope the people of Calne remember the behaviour of some of their elected representatives when the time comes to elect a new council.
This sorry saga has become very sad. What started as a simple request for the Union Flag to be flown over the Town Hall, has degenerated into the council being left looking petty and foolish. If raising the flag carries such risk, does this merit an investigation into how the flag was flown in the past?
I hope the people of Calne remember the behaviour of some of their elected representatives when the time comes to elect a new council.
Posted by: weirdbeard, Chippenham on 10:08am Fri 25 Jul 08
Hasn't everyone got anything better to do than to try and get a flag stuck onto a building? What on earth would you all do next if the council caved in?
Hasn't everyone got anything better to do than to try and get a flag stuck onto a building? What on earth would you all do next if the council caved in?
Posted by: Sticky, Calne on 11:31am Fri 25 Jul 08
[quote][bold]weirdbeard[/bold] wrote:
Hasn't everyone got anything better to do than to try and get a flag stuck onto a building? What on earth would you all do next if the council caved in?[/quote] Yet another helpful thoughtful in-depth well rounded response from someone outside Calne!!! Have you not got anything better to do than read and respond to issues that do not concern you!
weirdbeard wrote:
Hasn't everyone got anything better to do than to try and get a flag stuck onto a building? What on earth would you all do next if the council caved in?
Yet another helpful thoughtful in-depth well rounded response from someone outside Calne!!! Have you not got anything better to do than read and respond to issues that do not concern you!
Posted by: Sticky, Calne on 11:38am Fri 25 Jul 08
This farce makes those councillors that objected to this look as ridiculous as is their council!! For goodness sake and in the name of reason and sanity just put the blinking flag up, grow up and work together for the good of the whole town.
The reasons not to put this flag up are very clearly personal and revolve around the Mayoress. I take it the council realise that no one with half a brain or any modicum of intelligence can begin to understand what the heck the council are playing at.
You have flown flags in the past when you please and there have been no anti flag flying voting or nonsense going on then.
JUST FLY THE THING! You can then argue amongst yourselves about what is best until you are all voted out of office.
This farce makes those councillors that objected to this look as ridiculous as is their council!! For goodness sake and in the name of reason and sanity just put the blinking flag up, grow up and work together for the good of the whole town.
The reasons not to put this flag up are very clearly personal and revolve around the Mayoress. I take it the council realise that no one with half a brain or any modicum of intelligence can begin to understand what the heck the council are playing at.
You have flown flags in the past when you please and there have been no anti flag flying voting or nonsense going on then.
JUST FLY THE THING! You can then argue amongst yourselves about what is best until you are all voted out of office.
Posted by: spooks, calne on 1:43pm Fri 25 Jul 08
[quote][bold]weirdbeard[/bold] wrote:
Hasn't everyone got anything better to do than to try and get a flag stuck onto a building? What on earth would you all do next if the council caved in?[/quote] It is what the flag represents.
www.calnetalk.com
weirdbeard wrote:
Hasn't everyone got anything better to do than to try and get a flag stuck onto a building? What on earth would you all do next if the council caved in?
It is what the flag represents.
www.calnetalk.com
Posted by: Harris, Calne on 11:12pm Sun 27 Jul 08
If the chimps who won’t represent Calne’s people can get something as simple as leaving a Union Flag up a flagpole at the bequest of their electorate so unimaginably wrong then what else are they messing up? For more detail about this 9 month show of utter incompetence visit www.calnetalk.com – it stretches to 12 pages to date so get a cuppa first…
If the chimps who won’t represent Calne’s people can get something as simple as leaving a Union Flag up a flagpole at the bequest of their electorate so unimaginably wrong then what else are they messing up? For more detail about this 9 month show of utter incompetence visit www.calnetalk.com – it stretches to 12 pages to date so get a cuppa first…
Posted by: Grumpy, Chippenham on 11:26pm Mon 28 Jul 08
How Calne town council can make such a long winded issue out of flying the flag when there is such clear support for it is quite baffeling. I dont quite follow why someone has sujested that it is personal and involves the mayor as surely the council had a vote and therefore they are collectively responsible. trying to avoid flying it under the guise of health and safety issues is quite pityful really
How Calne town council can make such a long winded issue out of flying the flag when there is such clear support for it is quite baffeling. I dont quite follow why someone has sujested that it is personal and involves the mayor as surely the council had a vote and therefore they are collectively responsible. trying to avoid flying it under the guise of health and safety issues is quite pityful really
Posted by: Miles Armstrong, Calne on 11:13am Tue 29 Jul 08
nearly every one in Calne wants to fly the flag to show our support for our troops and to show them were proud of them but the council keeps stopping us doing it why? because they don't like the person who first spoke about it (john irelad) and they think flying the flag would mean he would win so they vote agaisnt the people in calne. they dont like jon ireland because he voted against the mayoress being mayoress. we should be able to sack these idiots before they ruin our town because they just vote for personel reasons not the good of the twon
nearly every one in Calne wants to fly the flag to show our support for our troops and to show them were proud of them but the council keeps stopping us doing it why? because they don't like the person who first spoke about it (john irelad) and they think flying the flag would mean he would win so they vote agaisnt the people in calne. they dont like jon ireland because he voted against the mayoress being mayoress. we should be able to sack these idiots before they ruin our town because they just vote for personel reasons not the good of the twon
Posted by: Grumpy, Chippenham on 11:28pm Wed 30 Jul 08
Surely that cannot be the reason???? That would be ridiculous!!!
Surely that cannot be the reason???? That would be ridiculous!!!
Posted by: weirdbeard, Chippenham on 12:41pm Thu 31 Jul 08
[quote][bold]Sticky[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]weirdbeard[/bold] wrote:
Hasn't everyone got anything better to do than to try and get a flag stuck onto a building? What on earth would you all do next if the council caved in?[/quote] Yet another helpful thoughtful in-depth well rounded response from someone outside Calne!!! Have you not got anything better to do than read and respond to issues that do not concern you![/quote] No, I haven't. This is fun. Don't be a pain in the @rse.
Sticky wrote:
weirdbeard wrote:
Hasn't everyone got anything better to do than to try and get a flag stuck onto a building? What on earth would you all do next if the council caved in?
Yet another helpful thoughtful in-depth well rounded response from someone outside Calne!!! Have you not got anything better to do than read and respond to issues that do not concern you!
No, I haven't. This is fun. Don't be a pain in the @rse.
Posted by: Linda, calne on 3:33pm Thu 31 Jul 08
I was asked for comments for an article on the flag for this weeks Gazette, as they have not been printed I would like to set the record straight from the Town Council's point of view.
"No decision has been made against the RBL flying the union flag from the Town Hall on the grounds of H & S and no such report has been issued by the Town Clerk. The Town Clerk is currently in liaison with the Town Council's H & S advisors and insurers, as the Town Council and Town Clerk, have a duty of care to ensure all employees, visitors , sub-contractors etc who are on Town Council owned property undertaking whatever activity are able to do so in a safe manner which complies with the law. These measures are a requirement in law and by the Town Council's insurers. They will also protect the Town Council from claims which could be made against it, if someone injured themselves whilst putting up or taking down the flag from the Town Hall roof. The HSC suggest that under the Corporate Manslaughter and Corporate Homicide Act 2007 'an offence is committed where failings by an organisation's senior management are a substantial element in any gross breach of duty of care owed to the organisation's employees or members of the public' ... So the Town Clerk is not acting deviously or sneakily as suggeted in the national newspapers, but doing the job.
The findings of the Risk Assessments, advice from insurers and H & S advisors will be discussed by the committee chairs before the end of this week'.
I was asked for comments for an article on the flag for this weeks Gazette, as they have not been printed I would like to set the record straight from the Town Council's point of view.
"No decision has been made against the RBL flying the union flag from the Town Hall on the grounds of H & S and no such report has been issued by the Town Clerk. The Town Clerk is currently in liaison with the Town Council's H & S advisors and insurers, as the Town Council and Town Clerk, have a duty of care to ensure all employees, visitors , sub-contractors etc who are on Town Council owned property undertaking whatever activity are able to do so in a safe manner which complies with the law. These measures are a requirement in law and by the Town Council's insurers. They will also protect the Town Council from claims which could be made against it, if someone injured themselves whilst putting up or taking down the flag from the Town Hall roof. The HSC suggest that under the Corporate Manslaughter and Corporate Homicide Act 2007 'an offence is committed where failings by an organisation's senior management are a substantial element in any gross breach of duty of care owed to the organisation's employees or members of the public' ... So the Town Clerk is not acting deviously or sneakily as suggeted in the national newspapers, but doing the job.
The findings of the Risk Assessments, advice from insurers and H & S advisors will be discussed by the committee chairs before the end of this week'.
Posted by: Grumpy, Chippenham on 12:33am Fri 1 Aug 08
Gawd all that just highlights whats gone wrong with this country
Gawd all that just highlights whats gone wrong with this country
Posted by: weirdbeard, Chippenham on 4:30pm Mon 4 Aug 08
[quote][bold]Grumpy[/bold] wrote:
Gawd all that just highlights whats gone wrong with this country[/quote] Yes, a total lack of apostrophes in your case.
Grumpy wrote:
Gawd all that just highlights whats gone wrong with this country
Yes, a total lack of apostrophes in your case.
Posted by: weirdbeard, Chippenham on 4:31pm Mon 4 Aug 08
[quote][bold]Linda[/bold] wrote:
I was asked for comments for an article on the flag for this weeks Gazette, as they have not been printed I would like to set the record straight from the Town Council's point of view.
"No decision has been made against the RBL flying the union flag from the Town Hall on the grounds of H & S and no such report has been issued by the Town Clerk. The Town Clerk is currently in liaison with the Town Council's H & S advisors and insurers, as the Town Council and Town Clerk, have a duty of care to ensure all employees, visitors , sub-contractors etc who are on Town Council owned property undertaking whatever activity are able to do so in a safe manner which complies with the law. These measures are a requirement in law and by the Town Council's insurers. They will also protect the Town Council from claims which could be made against it, if someone injured themselves whilst putting up or taking down the flag from the Town Hall roof. The HSC suggest that under the Corporate Manslaughter and Corporate Homicide Act 2007 'an offence is committed where failings by an organisation's senior management are a substantial element in any gross breach of duty of care owed to the organisation's employees or members of the public' ... So the Town Clerk is not acting deviously or sneakily as suggeted in the national newspapers, but doing the job.
The findings of the Risk Assessments, advice from insurers and H & S advisors will be discussed by the committee chairs before the end of this week'.
[/quote] It's about time someone wrote a sitcom about all of this. It's hilarious.
Linda wrote:
I was asked for comments for an article on the flag for this weeks Gazette, as they have not been printed I would like to set the record straight from the Town Council's point of view.
"No decision has been made against the RBL flying the union flag from the Town Hall on the grounds of H & S and no such report has been issued by the Town Clerk. The Town Clerk is currently in liaison with the Town Council's H & S advisors and insurers, as the Town Council and Town Clerk, have a duty of care to ensure all employees, visitors , sub-contractors etc who are on Town Council owned property undertaking whatever activity are able to do so in a safe manner which complies with the law. These measures are a requirement in law and by the Town Council's insurers. They will also protect the Town Council from claims which could be made against it, if someone injured themselves whilst putting up or taking down the flag from the Town Hall roof. The HSC suggest that under the Corporate Manslaughter and Corporate Homicide Act 2007 'an offence is committed where failings by an organisation's senior management are a substantial element in any gross breach of duty of care owed to the organisation's employees or members of the public' ... So the Town Clerk is not acting deviously or sneakily as suggeted in the national newspapers, but doing the job.
The findings of the Risk Assessments, advice from insurers and H & S advisors will be discussed by the committee chairs before the end of this week'.
It's about time someone wrote a sitcom about all of this. It's hilarious.
Posted by: barbarella68, calne on 7:25pm Sun 10 Aug 08
Everybody knows that Linda is talking a load of rubbish-Council didn't want flag-Council is finding ways to get there own way.There we go simple.This council as we all know do not care about the people of Calne only about what is in it for themselves.
Once they get it into their thick heads they were voted in by the common people and must do as we want not as they tell us,the majority want it put it up now!
Can somebody tell me why the mayors party food cost £600.00 plus but they couldn't justify £80.00,very strange.Unless the food was bought by the mayor herself but I expect unlikely,how much food was wasted at the end of the party and chucked away I wonder.
Everybody knows that Linda is talking a load of rubbish-Council didn't want flag-Council is finding ways to get there own way.There we go simple.This council as we all know do not care about the people of Calne only about what is in it for themselves.
Once they get it into their thick heads they were voted in by the common people and must do as we want not as they tell us,the majority want it put it up now!
Can somebody tell me why the mayors party food cost £600.00 plus but they couldn't justify £80.00,very strange.Unless the food was bought by the mayor herself but I expect unlikely,how much food was wasted at the end of the party and chucked away I wonder.
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